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hyperpiston
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on: December 19, 2013 02:09
Galadivren said:

[Melethenin/Mellenin] gin aphadathon na 'urth a athan

Melethenin = My love
Mellenin = My dear (as you used Mell yourself I thought I'd give it as an option). Both of these use the suffix -enin as an endearment, instead of implying that you own him.
gin aphadathon = I will follow you
na = to
'urth = death
a = and
athan = beyond

Compass points
North = Forod is more usual
East = Amrûn
South = Harad
West = Annûn

[Edited on 12/19/2013 by Galadivren]
Oh thank you so much! I hope it doesn't sound awkward. I thought it sounded romantic but then I'm not good at meanings or poetry.

I think the suffix will make more sense to me when I start working on the lessons, thank you for helping me with that, too!
Galadivren
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on: December 19, 2013 04:15
The difference is basically, that you either use:
I veleth nin = My love (possessive pronoun, implies ownership)
or
Melethenin = My love (endearment, possessive suffix).

(excuse lack of accent on nin)
hyperpiston
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on: December 20, 2013 10:49
Ooh, seeing the two side by side makes more sense. Thank you!

[Edited on 12/20/2013 by hyperpiston]
AnariaLaurelin
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on: January 15, 2014 04:43
How do you say "May the light of the stars shine upon you, and the Two Trees be ever in your heart." I was thinking that's a great Elvish blessing, especially if it was actually in the language! If you can translate it, would you mind telling me if your translation is Sindarin or Quenya?

Thanks!
Anarien
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Galadivren
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on: January 21, 2014 03:57
AnariaLaurelin said:How do you say "May the light of the stars shine upon you, and the Two Trees be ever in your heart." I was thinking that's a great Elvish blessing, especially if it was actually in the language! If you can translate it, would you mind telling me if your translation is Sindarin or Quenya?

Thanks!
Anarien


As this is the Sindarin forum, here's a Sindarin option for you:

i galad [in-elenath/i-ngiliath] sílo am [len/gin], a i ngaladhad mi gûregen anuir

The light of the stars shine upon you, and the Two Trees in your heart forever


Choices in brackets:
in-elenath = of the stars, archaic
i-ngiliath = of the stars, Third Age, general conversation
len = you, formal (thee)
gin = you, informal

I've used gûregen = your heart. This is gûr = heart, moral sense, as opposed to the physical heart, plus the possessive suffix instead of implying ownership.

[Edited on 01/21/2014 by Galadivren]
AnariaLaurelin
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on: January 21, 2014 06:56
Thanks! Now why didn't they use that in the movie when Galadriel blessed the Fellowship?
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bright_blue_eyes
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on: February 01, 2014 07:59
I'm having a bit of trouble translating this one line into Sindarin, and if anyone could help me I would greatly appreciate it!

The line is: The Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty forever beyond its reach.

Thanks!

[Edited on 02/06/2014 by bright_blue_eyes]
Ransidcheese
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on: February 03, 2014 09:47
Hello. I'd like to ask this girl to senior prom in sindarin. I know there won't be a word for prom but I think it could be replaced by the phrase "spring dance" or something similar. I'd like to say "It would bring me great joy if you would accompany me to prom." or at least as close to that as you can get. Please. Thank you.
Ransidcheese
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on: February 03, 2014 09:47
Hello. I'd like to ask this girl to senior prom in sindarin. I know there won't be a word for prom but I think it could be replaced by the phrase "spring dance" or something similar. I'd like to say "It would bring me great joy if you would accompany me to prom." or at least as close to that as you can get. Please. Thank you.
Ransidcheese
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on: February 03, 2014 09:50
Sorry 'bout the double post. My Internet had a hiccup.
Winterborn
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on: February 04, 2014 10:13
Hi everyone! I'm trying to translate a quote and I've made some really amateur progress on it. Any help or suggestions will be greatly appreciated! The quote is
All that is gold does not glitter, Not all those who wander are lost.
I made some changes to it to get a rough word for word translation and came up with

All gold will not glitter, Not all who wander (are) straying. Which translates to
pân côl ava thilia, ú pân i revia mistad. (I think?)
I know that isn't correct grammer but again, please help a noobie out.
Galadivren
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on: February 05, 2014 06:24
Winterborn said:Hi everyone! I'm trying to translate a quote and I've made some really amateur progress on it. Any help or suggestions will be greatly appreciated! The quote is
All that is gold does not glitter, Not all those who wander are lost.
I made some changes to it to get a rough word for word translation and came up with

All gold will not glitter, Not all who wander (are) straying. Which translates to
pân côl ava thilia, ú pân i revia mistad. (I think?)
I know that isn't correct grammer but again, please help a noobie out.


There's a much simpler way to translate these two lines, and that's to use the -ath suffix.

Collath ú-thilia = All that is gold does not glisten
ú randirath mistar = Not all those who wander are lost
Galadivren
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on: February 05, 2014 06:27
Ransidcheese said:Hello. I'd like to ask this girl to senior prom in sindarin. I know there won't be a word for prom but I think it could be replaced by the phrase "spring dance" or something similar. I'd like to say "It would bring me great joy if you would accompany me to prom." or at least as close to that as you can get. Please. Thank you.


What about...

Nin annatha gell pe telithog adh nin an I Ethuil Liltho = It will give me joy if you come with me to the Spring Dance.
Winterborn
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on: February 05, 2014 06:51
Thank you Galadivren!
flugr
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on: February 05, 2014 12:58
I guess in my initial haste I posted in the wrong spot, this being the right place.
This is my initial thread with my link to where I started out on another site.
http://www.councilofelrond.com/forum/thread/36770/page/1/

What I'm trying to translate is "That others may live". Through my initial research I got something along the lines of "i pen alsuin chuiatha aen"
Or
"i edraith chuiatha aen"

Thanks in advance.
Ransidcheese
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on: February 05, 2014 04:08
Le hannon Galadivren. Harthon gerithach raid gelin a melthin. I hope I got that right.
Adharhid
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on: February 06, 2014 06:31
Galadivren,do you know a good site to download an english version of the tengwar?i've tried the ones listed on the site but they're very confusing to me.
Galadivren
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on: February 07, 2014 03:57
Sorry, I've never studied Tengwar, I have no idea. Perhaps this site will help? http://at.mansbjorkman.net/tengwar.htm

[Edited on 02/07/2014 by Galadivren]
Galadivren
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on: February 07, 2014 04:02
bright_blue_eyes said:I'm having a bit of trouble translating this one line into Sindarin, and if anyone could help me I would greatly appreciate it!

The line is: The Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty forever beyond its reach.

Thanks!

[Edited on 02/06/2014 by bright_blue_eyes]


Sorry I didn't reply to you sooner, I missed your post

I [dhae/dhúath] non nad vîw; calad ennas a vain chall anuir athan i raithad dîn

The shadow was a small frail thing; there was light and high beauty forever beyond its reaching.
Galadivren
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on: February 07, 2014 04:10
flugr said:I guess in my initial haste I posted in the wrong spot, this being the right place.
This is my initial thread with my link to where I started out on another site.
http://www.councilofelrond.com/forum/thread/36770/page/1/

What I'm trying to translate is "That others may live". Through my initial research I got something along the lines of "i pen alsuin chuiatha aen"
Or
"i edraith chuiatha aen"

Thanks in advance.


I'll be honest, this isn't the easiest clause to translate.
Incidentally, aen doesn't mean 'may', we now know it's the conditional tense (though David Salo does still use it in the Hobbit films to indicate passive voice, but I'll excuse him because he would have done those translations before the release of VT/50).

i guiathar = that they will live
i guinathar = that they will be alive

Cuia = live
Cuina = to be alive

but that doesn't give you the full meaning of the English sentence. I'll continue to have a think.
Dainsie
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on: February 09, 2014 05:35
I was trying to translate the word "change" and I think I'm correct in saying that it is ahya. But I just want to verify how it is written in tengwar script. Can anyone help with this?
Galadivren
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on: February 10, 2014 10:02
Ahya- is a Quenya verb. If you want Sindarin, the equivalent verb is Eichia- = to change. Eichio! = Change! or Eichiad = Changing (this second form, called the gerund, is often used for the noun, but it's your choice obviously).
I can't help you with Tengwar however I'm afraid.
flugr
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on: February 10, 2014 02:37
Galadivren said:
flugr said:I guess in my initial haste I posted in the wrong spot, this being the right place.
This is my initial thread with my link to where I started out on another site.
http://www.councilofelrond.com/forum/thread/36770/page/1/

What I'm trying to translate is "That others may live". Through my initial research I got something along the lines of "i pen alsuin chuiatha aen"
Or
"i edraith chuiatha aen"

Thanks in advance.


I'll be honest, this isn't the easiest clause to translate.
Incidentally, aen doesn't mean 'may', we now know it's the conditional tense (though David Salo does still use it in the Hobbit films to indicate passive voice, but I'll excuse him because he would have done those translations before the release of VT/50).

i guiathar = that they will live
i guinathar = that they will be alive

Cuia = live
Cuina = to be alive

but that doesn't give you the full meaning of the English sentence. I'll continue to have a think.


That's actually kinda cool that one word replaces three

Yea, I found that "may" is crucial because simply using "will" seems to imply a certainty in the outcome, whereas "may" there isn't. Even after all is said and done they might not live. Using "will" changes it too much.
Dainsie
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on: February 12, 2014 03:57
Galadivren said:Ahya- is a Quenya verb. If you want Sindarin, the equivalent verb is Eichia- = to change. Eichio! = Change! or Eichiad = Changing (this second form, called the gerund, is often used for the noun, but it's your choice obviously).
I can't help you with Tengwar however I'm afraid.


Thank you so much!
findemaxam48
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on: February 13, 2014 03:21
Quick Question: I have recently finished my Sindarin CoE lessons. Would it be alright if I put up some of my translations, nd then someone could check to see if they were accurate? Trying to learn from my mistakes.
We were one in the same, running like moths to the flame. You'd hang on every word I'd say, but now they only ricochet.
Galadivren
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on: February 14, 2014 03:58
Go for it
findemaxam48
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on: February 14, 2014 05:16
Thank you so much, Galadivren! I will be back in a few days with a translation.
We were one in the same, running like moths to the flame. You'd hang on every word I'd say, but now they only ricochet.
findemaxam48
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on: February 17, 2014 06:36
OK, here goes:


Actual:


The snow glows white, on the mountain tonight, not a footprint to be seen. A kingdom of isolation, and it looks like I'm the queen.

Literal:

The snow remains white, on the mountain this night, not a mark to be seen. A kingdom alone, and it appears I'm the queen.


Sindarin:

I loss dartha nim erin orod sen du, u-taith na cen. Arad erui, thia I vereth.



Any and all construstive critism is welcome and encouraged.
We were one in the same, running like moths to the flame. You'd hang on every word I'd say, but now they only ricochet.
Alexanda
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on: February 17, 2014 08:41
It seems quite good to me. But my opinion is not valid yet lol. I thought when there's a noun and adjective, the adjective comes AFTER the noun. Not sure if that applies here though...
Eglerio Eru o I gely bân siriar. (Praise God from Whom all blessing flow)
Galadivren
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on: February 18, 2014 02:55
Pretty good! Here are my comments:

I loss dartha faen/'lân/nimp, erin orod i fuin hen, ú rein an gened. Arnad erui, a thia ni i vereth.

Faen = Radiant white
'lân = Shining white
nimp = white (not nim)
rein = footprint (you can have an exact translation!)
i fuin hen = this night (surround the word with the pronoun)
arnad = kingdom arad = day
ni = I am


[Edited on 02/18/2014 by Galadivren]
Elhath
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on: February 18, 2014 03:40
There is a word for "footprint" — ruin or †rein (Etym:384; #1 = 'mature' S result < OS *runia < CE *runjā [cp. PM:366]).

"To be seen" — one solution for the "(be) X-able/-ible" phrase type here would be athgen (PE17:148, cp. Q ascenë, ascénima "visible, easily seen" on same page).

Defensible synonyms for "solitude" : !ereth (= Gn, LT1:269), *eruias (cp. thinnas "shortness" ). Since the original had "of isolation", one may also consider e-heidi-ad (-od) "of setting-aside" (< seidia-).

[Edited on 02/19/2014 by Elhath]
LotR-era Sindarin subject pronouns (with verbs) ❖ On translating "until" ❖ Old /-ch/ of /man agorech/ discussed
findemaxam48
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on: February 18, 2014 12:41
Galadivren said:Pretty good! Here are my comments:

I loss dartha faen/'lân/nimp, erin orod i fuin hen, ú rein an gened. Arnad erui, a thia ni i vereth.

Faen = Radiant white
'lân = Shining white
nimp = white (not nim)
rein = footprint (you can have an exact translation!)
i fuin hen = this night (surround the word with the pronoun)
arnad = kingdom arad = day
ni = I am


[Edited on 02/18/2014 by Galadivren]



Thank you, Galadivren! Some of the errors I made were because of my inability to read my own handwriting (Arad instead or Arnad, nin instead of nin) because I do all my translating ina notebook. And I guess I was too hasty in my paraphrasing- I assummed that there was no word for footprint, so I just changed it without checking.

More attempts to follow!
We were one in the same, running like moths to the flame. You'd hang on every word I'd say, but now they only ricochet.
findemaxam48
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on: February 20, 2014 04:51
OK, so I have another attempt. This one is probably much more of a mess, and it is absolutely fine if you agree with that.

"The wind is howling, like this swirling storm inside, cannot keep it in, heaven knows I tried."

"The wind is coming like this storm in me, not able to hold it in, heaven, watch my pain." (Gave myself a huge headache over the last three words. Any suggestions?)

Sindarin:

I 'wae tol sui hen alagos vi nin, u-gar na gar ha ne, menel, tirith nin naeg.
We were one in the same, running like moths to the flame. You'd hang on every word I'd say, but now they only ricochet.
Galadivren
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on: February 21, 2014 12:53
I 'waew gâw, sui i alagos hen mi nin. ú-bolin (belin) garo den mi nin, menel ista i demmin.
The wind howls, as this storm in me. I cannot hold it in me, heaven knows that I tried.

Gaw- = to howl, so gâw = it howls, it is howling
i alagos hen = this storm (of wind). Remember that all possessive pronouns take the form i ____ pronoun, don't put it before the word.
ú-bolin (belin) = I cannot*
garo = hold
ista- = to know
def- = to try

* the verb is pol- = to be able to, but if we mutate it 'as expected', it ends up identical to pel-. It's my own personal theory that this isn't tenable, and the Elves wouldn't have done this, as you would not be able to tell the meaning simply from context in most situations, thus I have my own ideas about which ones mutate and why.
Elhath
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on: February 21, 2014 02:14

* the verb is pol- = to be able to, but if we mutate it 'as expected', it ends up identical to pel-. It's my own personal theory that this isn't tenable, and the Elves wouldn't have done this, as you would not be able to tell the meaning simply from context in most situations, thus I have my own ideas about which ones mutate and why.


Either opting for gar- (geri-) or reintroducing !tor- (teri-) (< Gn, PE11:72) would of course take care of this problem.

Employing mature Sindarin's 'usual' vowel-lengthening (WJ:415, PE17) to create a past 1 sg. from ⁿdef- would imaginably give *eniven "I tried, have tried" — though personally I do think the "Noldorin style" nasal lengthening can still occasionally appear just as it is still attested (indeed, for stop-final roots) in PE17, although there prefixed with the root vowel (hence NDEB > *enemmin, vs. suffixed -ant > *ⁿdevennin sec. PE17:44). Alternatively, PE17 also provides the probably synonymous verb (unglossed by Tolkien) raitha-, #ritha- (from root RIK- 'strive', giving Q ric- 'try, strive, endeavour') : Renk

"Keep in[side], contain" might be representable simply with one S word; ergo *necheb-ed < KHEP-. (Also good to note: Tolkien's English translations in The War of the Jewels pp. 371 [S], 404 [Q] seem to suggest that "it" as an object doesn't necessarily always require a separate indicator, at least not with an imperative verb.)

[Edited on 02/22/2014 by Elhath]
LotR-era Sindarin subject pronouns (with verbs) ❖ On translating "until" ❖ Old /-ch/ of /man agorech/ discussed
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