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Forum Home » Languages » Sindarin Discussion » Mode of Tengwar on the Doors of Durin?
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BriTheElf
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Post Mode of Tengwar on the Doors of Durin?
on: May 05, 2015 04:42
I didn't want to start a new thingy, and I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask this, but I couldn't find an explanation or chart on the expanded tengwar which is written on the Doors of Durin. Does anyone know where I can find one? Is the inscription in Sindarin, Quenya or common language? Why is it in expanded tengwar? So much confusion.
I really just need a chart of the characters, but answers to any of the above questions would be much appreciated!
Elthir
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on: May 05, 2015 10:32
Hello

The inscription is written in Sindarin and is in the Mode of Beleriand. Below I'll link to a page where you can see the characters.

There is an interesting statement from Tolkien, noted here in this passage from the link, with my emphasis.

This "antique S[indarin] mode" [DTS 58] is a mode of quanta sarme ["full writing"], meaning that both consonants and vowels are written with tengwar. In this it followed the quanta sarme which Feanor created "for the Loremasters" to represent Quenya. It is said that for languages such as Sindarin, "the diacritic method of indicating vowels was inconvenient"


http://at.mansbjorkman.net/teng_beleriand.htm

Technically the names Durin, Narvi, while in the picture of the doors in the books and written with the Elvish letters of course, are Old Norse in form. Durin for example is an Old Norse name which cannot possibly be written upon the actual doors, since Old Norse didn't exist yet.

We must imagine that Durin represents some real name in a Mannish language; in other words, we must imagine that the true "outer" name of Durin is on the actual doors, and that that unknown name has been written using the Elvish letters (just like its "modern" translation "Durin" has been written with Elvish letters in the picture in the book).

Thankfullly for Tolkien the picture in the book is not a photograph of the actual doors

This confusing matter of translation (Tolkien's conceit of translating certain names in the books, see Appendix F On Translation) is just a side issue here in any case (as is why the Sindarin name Moria appears in the picture). As I say, the main text is in Sindarin.

[Edited on 05/06/2015 by Elthir]
BriTheElf
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on: May 06, 2015 05:46
Thank you so much!!!
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