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IRizWhale
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Post A quick translation check
on: June 21, 2016 10:29
Hi, I was translating something and I just wanted to see if it's right. Does saying "Eglerio i Anor!" translate to "Praise the Sun!" with the same meaning and everything?
Lokyt
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on: June 21, 2016 10:54
Lokyt
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on: June 21, 2016 11:01
I would say that (according to VT 44, p. 25-26) it basically does, but It's also ambiguous, since it can be understood as "praise the Sun!" as well as "let the Sun praise (something else)!".
A better solution should be eglerio den i Anor, literally "praise it, the Sun", to mark the Sun as a syntactic object.
IRizWhale
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on: June 22, 2016 01:45
Thanks for the reply! But, can you explain to me why "den" is "it". I struggle with grammar in English, let alone other languages, and pronouns are still fuzzy to me, and from the basic online guides I've found seem to contradict each other. Is it because it would be a direct object? Or, could you recommend a good source(s) for learning?


Never mind the den-it thing I figured it out (you use "ten" as the direct object form of it, but since it receives the action of the verb it gets a soft mutation, t->d, so den). Thanks for your help again, but can you still recommend some good sources?
[Edited on 06/22/2016 by IRizWhale]

[Edited on 06/22/2016 by IRizWhale]
Lokyt
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on: June 23, 2016 12:35
Correct There supposedly was some personal/demonstrative pronoun t- (I think we actually don't know its full basic form), of which the accusative case form (= the direct object form) takes the accusative ending -n to become ten. And this gets lenited, when really taking on the role of an object in a sentence.

Now, you're perfectly right that the available sources are contradictory when it comes to pronouns. That's because Tolkien himself is contradictory at this , as he kept changing his mind about the pronouns all his life and little of his materials on this topic has been published (or maybe little exists at all).

As for sources for learning, I'm afraid I know nothing I could recommend besides Tolkien himself...
After all, a great deal of Tolkien's linguistic writings still remain unpublished (and thus unavailable), so most of the studies/books/analysies already written are either outdated (by what of Tolkien's materials has been published later), or are in a great danger of getting outdated in future (when - as we all hope - the editors publish even more).

[Edited on 06/23/2016 by Lokyt]
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