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starofdunedain
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Post Dwarvish
on: October 09, 2009 09:59
I've got another pesky question. This time about dwarvish.
Why is there nothing on dwarvish (Khuzdul) in the language section?
We only have a handful of phrases, yes. But there is also the rune chart in the Appendicies of Return of the King, which if I understand correctly, was the elvish lettering system before Feanor had created Tengwar, that was taken up and modified by the dwarves?
I would think that if a few of us put our heads together we could make a respectable list of Dwarvish phrases such as the ones in Sindarin and Quenya?
Unless I'm the only one who's interested?
TheCrow
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Post RE: Dwarvish
on: October 11, 2009 08:18
do you mean this one:

ImageImage

....but i don't see how this chart could give us any additional info about Khuzdul?! (i mean anything we don't already know?!)

[Edited on 11/10/2009 by TheCrow]
starofdunedain
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Post RE: Dwarvish
on: October 11, 2009 10:19
But what do we know? That's my point. A person could spend a couple hours sifting through the books trying to find all the references and instances of dwarvish, so why shouldn't it be made more convienient by having one section on everything we know about it? I would think at least a few people would be happy to know some dwarvish phrases to impress their friends? (especially the rp gamers)
TheCrow
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Post RE: Dwarvish
on: October 11, 2009 11:12
" why shouldn't it be made more convienient by having one section on everything we know about it?"

well i haven't checked if they have something like that on here...but you could always use Ardalambion: http://folk.uib.no/hnohf/khuzdul.htm or this one: http://forodrim.org/daeron/md_khuzdul.html, there you'll find pretty much everything we know about Khuzdul (which is not much)...
Teciltur
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Post RE: Dwarvish
on: October 11, 2009 06:02
I believe what starofdunedain means is that there ought to be a section about Khuzdul here on CoE, TheCrow (which there isn't, currently, save the Encyclopedia entry).
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and go well with ketchup.
starofdunedain
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Post RE: Dwarvish
on: October 11, 2009 07:17
Yes, thank you Teciltur. What I should have stated was that I think there should be a section of phrases and a dictionary for Khuzdul here like there is for Sindaran ,quenya, noldorin, rohirric (old english) and black speech. We know very little about black speech but there's still a dictionary for it, so why not Khuzdul?. I'd be more than willing to do my homework for it.
Those two sites are helpful, but they're more of an analysis than a compilation.
I'm not sure who's in charge of the content in the language section?

[Edited on 12/10/2009 by starofdunedain]
Lex
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Post RE: Dwarvish
on: October 28, 2009 11:39
We know very very little about khuzdûl... I believe that's why there's no section dadicated to dwarvish here in CoE. Making use of just a small handful of phrases in dwarvish would not be that cool. I think people would soon get tired off. But i would really like Tolkien had developed Khuzdûl and Adûnaic (and the Black Speech as well) as much as he developed Quenya or Sindarin! Unfortunately, that is not the case...
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Post RE: Dwarvish
on: January 07, 2010 05:52
While it's true that we know more words of Khuzdul than we do of some other languages, we don't know much about the grammar (unlike Adunaic where we have at least a fragmentary grammar written by the professor himself). In addition the words of Khuzdul that we know are not terribly useful for our everyday lives, and there are some really basic ones missing. Unlike the Black Speech we have no way of taking words from another language and playing with them to form words (because Khuzdul has no 'archaic' speech or anything like that), whereas with the Black Speech most of the words we have are reconstructed from Valian, Proto-Elvish roots, and Quenya or Qenya, but this is justified because of how the language was supposedly created (by messing with words from these tongues). However Tolkein says that Khuzdul was made by Aulë for the dwarves, with no historical predecessor, and remaining completely unchanged through the centuries.

[Edited on 27/1/2010 by Elarin_Aragorniel]
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