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Forum Home » Books Discussion » BC Archive: Lord of the Rings » Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
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PotbellyHairyfoot
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Post Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 11, 2004 09:51
From TTT chapter VII, Helm's Deep
"
'The end will not be long', said the king. 'But I will not end here, taken like an old badger in a trap. Snowmane and Hasufel and the horses of my guard are in the inner court. When dawn comes, I will bid men sound Helm's horn, and I will ride forth. Will you ride with me then, son of Arathorn? maybe we shall cleave a road, or make such an end as will be worth a song - if any be left to sing of us hereafter.'


I think that this quote does speak volumes about Rohan's warrior culture

[Edited on 11/1/2004 by atalante_star]

[Edited on 28/1/2004 by Figwit]
atalante_star
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 11, 2004 11:12
Excellent quote! Just to let you book club people know, we've got a really good thread running in the Books Forum on a similar topic - a link is here.

Atalante
PotbellyHairyfoot
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 02:46
{In the book club discussion of this quote, I'm tryng to convey how it reflects the lmind-set of the Rohirrim rather than the courage of all peoples when faced with a hopeless cause.}

This quote, at least to me , indicates a Viiking-like culture for the Rohirrim.. Its not enough to die in battle, it's important to die gloriously in battle and be remembered in that way.. The Ridrers of Rohan remember and honour their ancestors , especially the great warriors amongst them, and to them it is important to live (and die) by the example set by those great warriors of their past.To me that is why Theoden would rather die in a charge upon the enemy then in a fight in the walls of Helm's Deep. He wants to show the world that the Riders care not for the overwhelming number of enemies or the futility of the charge; they will leave their mark on history in the way that they know best!!

[Edited on 12/1/2004 by PotbellyHairyfoot]
atalante_star
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 03:30
Yes .... the Rohirrim are undoubtedly An Anglo-Saxon type of people - with their most valiant death being a death in battle, coupled with almost a sense that battle and war was their pre-ordained fate - and therefore to be honoured.

I wonder if the Rohirrim had some sense of Valhalla - the Anglo-Saxon "heaven" where only those who died with swords in their hands were admitted. If they *didn't*, that would make their heroism even greater, I think. To die in battle knowing that one would be admitted to the halls of the great warriors in the after-life is one thing; dying in battle with no sense that the sacrifice would be honoured afterwards is another thing altogether.

Another point - wandering slightly OT - Tolkien always said that he admired the Anglo-Saxon spirit greatly, and above that of the spirit of other nations and races. Does he ever say anywhere that he particularly loved the Rohirrim? Though that would follow naturally from his love of the Anglo-Saxon notion of honour and fate, I can't remember anywhere that Tolkien admitted a particular love for the Rohirrim.
Figwit
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 05:18
To die in battle knowing that one would be admitted to the halls of the great warriors in the after-life is one thing; dying in battle with no sense that the sacrifice would be honoured afterwards is another thing altogether.


There is a line about joining forebearers later on (I think it's Théoden who says it), but there's no actual information about their religion. I guess on a certain level they would have to have some kind of idea of an afterlife, even if it's a negative one (like the Danish idea of the Ring of Chaos).

I do absolutely adore the Rohirrim, they are a wonderful race and one of Tolkien's most stunning creations: of all his races they are the most realistic one, probably because they were based on a real culture, but also because their actions and words are consistent with this background.

I do love that quote!
atalante_star
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 05:58
I'm still trying to find that line

I know it is mentioned in ?TTT, but Nienna-of-the-Valar and I have been trying to find its equivalent in the books to no avail
Figwit
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 06:13
I'll try to find it *Figwit to the Rescue*
Nienna-of-the-Valar
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 06:28
I'm not sure if this is what you are talking about guys, but it does give some insight into what Théoden thought awaited him "on the other side". But...it is from RotK so if you are avoiding spoilers, don't read anymore LOL.....




RotK, "The Battle of the Pelennor Fields":
"Farewell Master Holbytla!" he (Théoden) said. "My body is broken. I go to my fathers. And even in their mighty company I shall not now feel ashamed."

*Nienna to the rescue* LOL
Figwit
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 06:32
that was it! yeay! thank you Nienna *Nienna to the Rescue!*
atalante_star
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 06:58
oh thanks sweetie I *knew* it was there somewhere!
Ioreth_Fimbrethil
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 12, 2004 11:25
Yes, I would have known where to look too, I've been reading these parts many times recently. I just re-read it while listening to the ROTK soundtrack ... wow! By sheer coïncidence the cd played The Ride of The Rohirrim as I started, perfect!
I guess we could start a club here, I also fell in love with the Rohan culture, even more so after seing the movies. And the fact that they've used "my" colours helped I guess. I've been wearing green, burgundy red and brown for many years now. Ah, and I love horses of course!
Figwit
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 13, 2004 05:30
Well, I don't really care for horses - though I guess that I do have a strong bond with them through reading Lord Of the Rings, because everytime I write something of my own 'enter horse'.

You know, I always hear people tell me how amazing they think the Elves are, but I guess the Rohirrim aren't all that impopular after all!
Nienna-of-the-Valar
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 13, 2004 11:16
I'd imagine that on the surface, say first read or so (or upon viewing the movies), the Rohirrim seem pretty boring? But underneath they are one of the most fabulous of Tolkien's peoples. They are not "exceptional" as even the Númenóreans, and subsequently the Dúnedain, are. They have no Elvish blood, they have no Maiar blood, they are not descended from any people of extraordinary circumstances...they just are. And maybe that is part of the reason for their unique culture. They aren't "exceptional" in typical ways so they have found a way to make themselves stand out by being incredibly loyal and valiant, amongst other things. I *adore* them, as I adore most of the Race of Men, but I think the Rohirrim remain my favorite.
Figwit
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Post RE: Quote of the week - jan 11th, 2004 (3.VII.)
on: January 14, 2004 01:16
I guess what draws me in everytime is the incredible strength of their people, and the way all these characters seem to blend into one: Théoden with his desire for a valiant death and his fear of age making him 'old'; Éomer with his curious mixture of something very primitive and at the same time a glorious chivalrous demeanor; Éowyn's desire to take up some kind of place in the world; Háma's loyalty...
The Rohirrim are one character, they all have the same core of loyalty and determination, strength, a knowledge of every person having their place in this world... I guess that's why Gríma is so unlike them: because he's cheating, he's moving people out of positions they own.

I'm getting all weird again .
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