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Figwit
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Post ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 26, 2004 02:38
Caps for these two sequences can be found here and here.

Points of interest:
- Did you like the lair? Was it as you expected or too creepy, or not creepy enough?
- Her Royal Majesty herself: did you like her?
- If you read the books: did you like this less or more than the book version? Didn't you miss Sam?
- Did you like the Phial? Did you like the vision of Galadriel?
- Sam's fight with Shelob: did you like it? Was it credible?

And of course, which part did you like best?
Luthien_Telperien
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 26, 2004 03:50
- Did you like the lair? Was it as you expected or too creepy, or not creepy enough?

The book was creepier, but I can't see how they could have filmed the complete blackness or the intense stench or the thick air.

- Her Royal Majesty herself: did you like her?

I'm arachnophobic (good thing I'd read the books first!!!), but I should say I found the giant spiders in the second Harry Potter movie scarier. I did shriek for those ones, and that when my husband (who saw the movie before I did) had warned me it would be scarier than the book!

- If you read the books: did you like this less or more than the book version? Didn't you miss Sam?

I did miss Sam, but I had so much enjoyed Sean Astin's acting when Sam was dismissed that I forgave the filmmakers on this one. I loved how Gollum's voice moved around.

- Did you like the Phial? Did you like the vision of Galadriel?

I expected the phial to be brighter, but there wasn't total darkness, so ...

I loved the vision of Galadriel. The editing was awesome.

- Sam's fight with Shelob: did you like it? Was it credible?

It was absolutely brilliant! It seemed to me to be quite faithful to the book while making excellent cinema. Loved the camera angles. I voted for this bit (though I was torn somewhat between this and the vision of Galadriel).

I love Frodo's face when he leaves the cave and through the Galadriel scene, by the way.
cbhalstead
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 26, 2004 05:16
I did miss Samwise. In the book he follows Gorbag and Shagrat down the tunnels after Frodo and is, in my opinion, a true hero and friend. But I think PJ did an awesome job adapting the book version to the movie version, I wouldn't have done it any other way.

I loved the scene with Galadriel. At that moment in the movie you needed something pure and you got it. I agree with Luthien_Telperien about the editing, they did a splendid job.

Shelob was undoubtedly creepy. When she stings Frodo, I had to cover my eyes after the first time I saw it . I just can't do it. I jumped so bad the first time I saw it that I got charley horses in my back. It scared the bejesus out of me. She scares me, and she's not even real. There were so many ways that she couldv'e been really goofy looking and PJ's warped (and I mean that in a good way) little mind must have known what it wanted, because I wouldn't change a single thing, she was MY worst nightmare.

The phial was the most beautiful thing. It truly stood up to the saying, "May it be a light to you in dark places, when all other lights go out." When he came to the darkest place of his journey, and I also believe in his heart, he had the phial that represents all beauty and peace.

And again, I agree with Luthien_Telperien, the book lair was creepier. When I was reading you could just imagine the stench and the dense air, and you just held your breath for most of that chapter.

Sam's fight with Shelob was just as I has imagined in the book, he was so brave. I thought the way that PJ did the scenes with Frodo telling Sam to go home and then he shows up and saves Frodo's life, he didn't have to, and yet you have to ask yourself, would you have done what Sam did? Would you have climbed all the way back up there and kicked some royal spider a## or would you have gone home? I am not sure what I would have done.
But what else would you have expected from Samwise The Brave? He truly stands up to that name in the end. :rolling:
~Andúril~
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 26, 2004 06:12
I thought the scene was good. PJ did a fine job of building suspense. When Frodo got caught in the web I though that was when Shelob was going to get him. But when he gets outside in that pit area and she jabbed him the the neck, man...I jumped straight up in the air. It was a bit freaky, but I really think he did a good job. I also think the EE should show Sam taking the ring from Frodo, because that is pretty important. But I thought the whole scene was great!

~Andúril~
fosca44
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 26, 2004 07:27
Alright, I've never quite forgiven PJ for making Frodo send Sam away, and I thought it was a bit too Hollywood-ish when Sam came back to save the day.

In other aspects, I think the part with Shelob is one of my favourite movie moments ever. Don't get me wrong, I'm a definite arachophobe and of course I don't enjoy seeing my movie heroes suffer - but I can't remember ever beeing so enraptured in a movie as when you feel like yelling to Frodo "Look up! Above you!" (I loved the camera angles!) When a movie lets me forget I'm in a theatre because I'm so spellbound with what I'm seeing onscreen, it's certainly a great feat!

My favourite LotR chapter of all time is 'The choices of Master Samwise' and they could have included some more of it, but the editing was acceptable. I'm not going to be brat and cry "No! They should have put it all in there!"
astra_celestine
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 28, 2004 07:26
I also think the EE should show Sam taking the ring from Frodo, because that is pretty important.


I don´t expect this scene to be in the EE. It will be more movie-like to keep the fate of the Ring secret till Sam´s appearance in the Tower so that the audience is kept in suspense up to the very moment Sam produces the Ring.
drunken_elf
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 29, 2004 12:21
The lair was pretty good, considering the restraints they had to work with (mentioned by some other people). It was pretty much how I'd imagined it.

I'll be honest, Shelob gives me the complete heeby-jeebies! Her crusty eye has tormented me every time! I love the way she moves, and the bit where she crawls out of that hole and hovers above Frodo is absolute genious filmmaking. Every single person in the cinema is holding their breath at that moment!

As for Sam, I think it was wise to deviate from the books here. I don't really know what else to say about it...Sam's fight with Shelob was good.

I loved the phial, and I loooooved the vision of Galadriel. Both beautiful. I especially like the grass in the vision of Galadriel - it just looks so suitably fragrant and soft (strange though I may sound ).

All in all, despite that the Frodo/Sam plot isn't my favourite I still enjoyed these scenes. I thought Gollum was particularly wonderful here!
I'm afraid that's the most meaningful post you'll get from me tonight .
Eruantalincë
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 29, 2004 02:16
- Did you like the lair? Was it as you expected or too creepy, or not creepy enough?
It was quite creepy. Even with light.
- Her Royal Majesty herself: did you like her?I hate spiders so creatures like Shelob reminds me why. She was awesome.
- If you read the books: did you like this less or more than the book version? Didn't you miss Sam?
It might be getting boring (and standard) but I like both versions for their own way. I missed Sam, yes. But this sequel also shows Frodo's weariness and vulnerability, due to the weight of the Ring in several ways.
- Did you like the Phial? Did you like the vision of Galadriel?
I loved this. It is a perfect moment of peace in a very hostile environment. Like the little talk between Gandalf and Pippin in Gondor. It also gives a good reason to show that Frodo is stronger than it seemed before in this particular sequel.
- Sam's fight with Shelob: did you like it? Was it credible?
I liked it, though I thought it would be a little longer. After all, she is a descendant of the great Ungoliant. On the other hand: she already did have a hunt and a struggle and it might be possible that she became somewhat lazy during her years in Cirith Ungol. I am glad it took Sam a lot of energy to fight her. Well, I cannot remember that she actually died in the movie; I thought she was hurt and retreated to (yeah, to do what?).

I voted for Sam saying goodbye to Frodo. It was so touching and sad :sob: with the line "Wake up! Don't leave me here alone! Don't go where I can't follow! Wake up!".
LinweSingollo
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 30, 2004 03:22
The lair - it was quite different from how I had pictured it, but it was still very creepy. The dead animals or....whatever, hanging from the ceiling added to the overall atmosphere of fear and terror.

HRM - Shelob was all that I expected her to be. I was afraid she'd look too B-grade movie monster-ish. The part where she's sneaking up on Frodo was brilliantly done. I agree with the other comments; great camera angles there. And Frodo getting caught in the web gave me the chills. You could really feel his fear. Gollum singing his nasty little song and hearing his voice coming from different locations...very spooky.

I missed Sam at first, but I'm fine with the movie version. I think it emphasized Frodo's fear and vulnerability more. Sam's fight with Shelob was credible...really showed his bravery.

Galadriel's phial - looked just as I had always pictured it. I'm glad they had Frodo crying out, "Aiya! Earendil Elenion Ancalima!"

Vision of Galadriel - I really like this part. A moment of hope and encouragement in an evil place. Loved Galadriel's warm smile as she lifts Frodo to his feet, and the music at that point...lovely!

Sam finding dead Frodo - I wanted this to be longer. I didn't get a feel for Sam's anguish and despair and indecision here like I do in the book. Seemed rushed. He's dead, no he's alive. o.k. moving on to the next scene.....I'm real glad they included the "don't go where I can't follow" line, though.

Overall, I loved the whole Shelob's Lair scene. And the music made my skin crawl.






[Edited on 1/5/2004 by LinweSingollo]
"To the Hobbits. May they outlast the Sarumans and see spring again in the trees." J.R.R. Tolkien
Nevthónîel
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: April 30, 2004 11:36
- Did you like the lair? Was it as you expected or too creepy, or not creepy enough?
It was quite well done, even though I think that it should be darker and a little more creepy. I can't tell why I don't think it was creepy enough, it was just something..
- Her Royal Majesty herself: did you like her?
Oh yes! The close-ups were really scary even for me, and I'm not very afraid of spiders. Yeah, she was definitely creepy enough!
- If you read the books: did you like this less or more than the book version? Didn't you miss Sam?
Of course I missed Sam. But yet, you can't really compare the movies and the books, they are different.
- Did you like the Phial? Did you like the vision of Galadriel?
That was my favourite. You need something light when everything's so dark.
- Sam's fight with Shelob: did you like it? Was it credible?
It was great, very well done, even though it was shorter than I imagined.

Allover it was a great sequence, and it was very creep the fisrt time I saw it.
Figwit
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: May 05, 2004 11:31
Did you like the lair? Was it as you expected or too creepy, or not creepy enough?

I was very very disappointed: it wasn't dark enough, and it was too 'horror'. It screamed PJ. I guess I had expected something like this from him, but it wasn't the lair from the book: I still get the creeps from that passage when I read it, and here I missed the dense darkness and the appearance of 'eyes'.
And Frodo being trapped like a fly, that was weird.

Her Royal Majesty herself: did you like her?
Not at first, I thought she wasn't creepy enough. But when she re-appears through the tunnel hole, that was freaky. That was one of the scariest things I've ever seen: she was very lifelike. I never liked how Tolkien depicted her, it was too fairy-like for my taste, but this was just a really big hairy spider and she freaked me out.
I especially liked her cowering away when she was hurt: that's a real spider!

If you read the books: did you like this less or more than the book version? Didn't you miss Sam?
Well, obviously I liked it less. I didn't miss Sam, but I would have liked to see them holding hands. What I missed most was the impenitrable darkness.

Did you like the Phial? Did you like the vision of Galadriel?
I was very glad to see the phial, it was magical (not like Eärendill came down from the heavens with the Silmaril on his brown, but good). I didn't like the vision of Galadriel however, it was stupid. Beautifully filmed, but stupid.

Sam's fight with Shelob: did you like it? Was it credible?
I don't like Sam.
fbc
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: May 14, 2005 09:53
I thought this was well done.
MerryandPip
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: May 17, 2005 03:14
I agree, but I but it was so freaky!! I have this phobia of spiders...My least favorite part is when Shelob is wrapping Frodo up...Auugh. The music in the movie freaks me out too.
Morna_Child_of_Eru
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob's Lair
on: May 17, 2005 07:48
Great comments everyone; very well thought-out. LotR definantly belongs to geeks (to me, "geek" is a high compliment).

I have to say that I saw the movies before I read the books, and saw ROTK for the first time in my living-room and not the silver screen. With that in mind, here's my response.

Did you like the lair? Was it as you expected or too creepy, or not creepy enough?

It was perfect. You knew exactly what kind of situation Frodo was in and was and what was going to come and try to kill him.

Her Royal Majesty herself: did you like her?

Even though I was bitten by a spider when I was a child, I don't find them particularly scary. When I see one, my response is "oh, lookie there. There's a spider on the wall. Think I'll get a book and kill it." Also, during the scenes between Frodo and Shelob, I was expecting Sam to show up any second, which distracted me from really focusing on the mortal danger Frodo was in. Having seen too many movies, I knew Sam was going to save him, so I couldn't be too scared.

If you read the books: did you like this less or more than the book version?

I read the books since seeing the movie, and I can't really say which version I like better. Each has it's good points. The book's depiction of Frodo and Sam stumbing around in the dark together is really touching, but I think the rift and reconcillation of Frodo and Sam adds a whole new layer of reality to their relationship.

Did you like the Phial? Did you like the vision of Galadriel?

I did like the Phial, but I LOVED it when I read Tolkien and found out the full story behind it (the Silmarill and the Light of the Two Trees, for instance). I did like the book version slightly more, in that (while Frodo does invoke Earendil) he doesn't have to "make" the phail light up. Elven things sense your need and do what you need them to do, which is so totally cool.

I did like the vision of Galadriel, mainly because I get to see the determination on Frodo's face when he takes her hand as he makes his decision to keep going.

Sam's fight with Shelob: did you like it? Was it credible?

Oh heck yeah I liked it! Sam is so brave and Sean plays it so well. I would have liked it a bit more if they'd have made it clearer that Shelob impails herself on Sting, but maybe that would have hurt Sam's heroism, and it was still great the way it was.
Sassyfriend
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Post Re: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #9: Shelob
on: September 20, 2012 11:52
This part was so freaky that i totally freck out when i see spiders now so no i don't like it at all
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