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Figwit
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Post ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: May 13, 2004 11:05
Caps can be found here.

Did you like this scene? Was it too long or too short? Did you get everything that happened? Was Frodo wearing boxers ? Did you like the moment where Sam can't let go of the Ring?

What was your favorite part?
Eruantalincë
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: May 13, 2004 02:04
I liked the discussion. It gave a good sight, I think, to the pure evil characters of the orcs, but also of the differences between at least two 'types' of orcs. While the Mordor-orcs would not think about keeping some stuff of Frodo, but bring it to the Great Eye, there are also orcs who did not have that much to do lately with Sauron en led (if that is correct) their own greedy life. And then the fall of one and the other one shouting "he's trying to stab me" (or something like that) and all orcs fighting. I think this is my favorite part.

By they way: did anyone notice the slight difference between the 'dresscodes' of the different types of orcs? The 'free' ones wear a shirt of metal rings (sorry, I really do not know what the word is for it), while the mordor-orcs seem to have leather protection, except for some metal thing around the neck.

I did not like Sam being the hero. Well, it was nice, but it was not exactly how I saw it when I read the books. But I liked the sentence "That's for Frodo, that's for the Shire. And that's for my old Gaffer". I do not know why, maybe a very subtile hint to the scouring?

About Frodo's boxers, I did not notice. To be frankly, I do not care. A friend of mine is an Elijah-fan, and she confirmed that he was wearing boxers.

I liked to see the disapointment and despair on Frodo's face and the somewhat greedy look when Sam showed the Ring. I liked to hear the Ring whisper (to Sam? to Frodo?). And I like the moment Sam did not seem to let the Ring go. At that moment, he is not "super-Sam", but just a mortal one, who is not immune for the power of it.

[Edited on 14/5/2004 by Eruantalincë]
Luthien_Telperien
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: May 14, 2004 03:48
What Eruantalincë said, mostly. I really missed Sam singing and Frodo echoing, though.
Figwit
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: May 14, 2004 04:42
Oh Luthien, I'd forgotten about that.

This is my least favorite movie scene, I guess, because I don't like Orcs and I don't like Sam and they're combined.

I did like the fact that Sam mentions his Gaffer, that was really nice. I didn't like heroic Sam, everyone knows that, but the moment where he couldn't let go of the Ring brought him back to his real proportions and almost made him likeable to me.

The the Orcs fighting amongst themselves was too short.
snowystingray
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: May 14, 2004 09:50
I think this was probably my least favourite scene as well. That doesn't mean that I hated it, just that it didn't stand out for me in any way. I do love Sam's Gaffer line. Frodo's underwear makes me giggle, too. Yes, I am a dork.
LinweSingollo
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: May 14, 2004 02:00
What Luthien said: I missed Sam singing and Frodo answering, too. I thought the scene was too short...but then I think most scenes in ROTK were too short. And half-naked Frodo...umm..yeah....wow...uh...I mean, poor Frodo...umm......I forgot what I was going to say......hehheh......what was the question??

[Edited on 16/5/2004 by LinweSingollo]
"To the Hobbits. May they outlast the Sarumans and see spring again in the trees." J.R.R. Tolkien
Morna_Child_of_Eru
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 12, 2005 10:17
I liked to see the disapointment and despair on Frodo's face and the somewhat greedy look when Sam showed the Ring. I liked to hear the Ring whisper (to Sam? to Frodo?). And I like the moment Sam did not seem to let the Ring go. At that moment, he is not "super-Sam", but just a mortal one, who is not immune for the power of it.


I agree that that's a powerful moment, and for me, it really does show that nobody is immune. That's how the actors were playing it according the Cast commentary. But according to the director's commentary, they wanted Sam to resist giving it back NOT because of the Ring's pull, but because he was worried about Frodo. That's an angle I hadn't considered, and if you look close at Sam's eyes when Frodo says "give me the ring", you can sort of see it.
MerryandPip
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 14, 2005 12:06


But according to the director's commentary, they wanted Sam to resist giving it back NOT because of the Ring's pull, but because he was worried about Frodo.


I agree with Morna_Child_of_Eru. But.... then again, in the book, Tolkien describes Sam's temptation to claim the ring for him self:

He felt that he had from now on only two choices,to for bear the ring, though it would torment him, or to claim it...Already the Ring tempted him, gnawing at his will and reason. Wild fantasies arose in his mind; and he saw Samwise the Strong, Hero of the Age, striding with a flaming sword across the darkedned land, and armies flocking to his call as he marched to the over throw of Barad-Dur....He had only to put on the ring and claim it for his own and all this could be.
Annûniel
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 14, 2005 01:56
Yes MerryandPip, although Sam dismissed that possiblity very quickly. But that occurance didn't happen when Frodo was asking for the Ring. That was before he decided to go back to save Frodo. Actually, when he was giving the Ring back to Frodo, he only hesitated because he was worried about it hurting his master again.

Now it had come to it, Sam felt reluctant to give up the Ring and burden his master with it again.


No other motive is given during that part of the novel. In fact, when Frodo sees the hesitation, he demands the Ring with more intensity and Sam gives the Ring to him without any further hesitation or thought.

*cough*

I liked the scene about the possessions between the Orcs and the Uruk-hai. They were "left over" Uruk-hai from Saruman's bunch weren't they? I don't know why I think that but I do. I could be wrong, but they aren't all the same kind of Orc anyway. It shows that they aren't all the same and the tensions between the two were so tight that even the smallest spark could set them off.

Like when the "Uruk-hai" orc fell out of the window suddenly they were all fighting even when those not in the tower couldn't actually tell why he fell out of the tower! He may have just slipped or something silly like that.
Eruantalincë
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 15, 2005 03:04
I liked to see the disapointment and despair on Frodo's face and the somewhat greedy look when Sam showed the Ring. I liked to hear the Ring whisper (to Sam? to Frodo?). And I like the moment Sam did not seem to let the Ring go. At that moment, he is not "super-Sam", but just a mortal one, who is not immune for the power of it.


I agree that that's a powerful moment, and for me, it really does show that nobody is immune. That's how the actors were playing it according the Cast commentary. But according to the director's commentary, they wanted Sam to resist giving it back NOT because of the Ring's pull, but because he was worried about Frodo. That's an angle I hadn't considered, and if you look close at Sam's eyes when Frodo says "give me the ring", you can sort of see it.
Yeah, so there are two points of view, which are both very likely. When I wrote my previous post, I did not see the movie with the commentaries, so it is just how I felt (and still feel) about it. But the other point of view (not wanting to burden Frodo again) is also a very good one.
MerryandPip
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 17, 2005 12:21
I also like how in FOTR, Frodo is very nervous when Aragorn appears. I love how Aragorn assures Frodo that he swore to protect him and Frodo says, "Can you protect me from yourself?" and how the ring whispers, "Aragorn".
hobbitnamedeliza
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 18, 2005 06:31
I voted for "reunited." I like the moment Sting glows blue as it emerges from the orc's chest and Sam declares "Not if I stick you first!" I like that moment when Frodo is himself and is able to be joyful in his rescue, heart-broken about his treatment of Sam on the stairs, despairing of the loss of the Ring...and frightened to death at the possibility of the Ring "taking" Sam. I really like the bit of acting Elijah does as the Ring slips over his head and the suffering returns to his eyes. I like Sam, despite the last few hours (plus a few VERY intense moments of being tempted by the Ring) being able to start directing the expedition again..."Let's find you some clothes...you can't go walking through Mordor in naught but your skin." Sam is taking care of things again...maybe, we hope, they'll get out of this alive yet.

A very powerful scene with LOTS of nuances!

[Edited on 19/3/2005 by hobbitnamedeliza]
MerryandPip
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 19, 2005 01:57
I laughed at "Not if I stick you first"! My sister loved Elijah's acting as the ring slipped over his head...how he looked as if her really looked how the ring was a heavy burden. I think this is a great discussion. Thanx, Figwit, for starting this post!
Morna_Child_of_Eru
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 19, 2005 10:32
I SO loved Sam's response when Frodo said "I'm so sorry." What an example of perfect forgiveness not to go into "I forgive you but let's make sure you understand how stupid you were and how bad you hurt me". Sam doesn't even say "it's alright Mr Frodo." First words out of his mouth: "let's get you out of here."

As far as Sam is concearned, the issue is over, the offense forgotten, and nothing else needs to be said about it. Reminds me of the dad in the Prodigal Son story.
MerryandPip
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 25, 2005 03:02
Aww.....That's so sweet! :love: Funny, I was listening to something about the Prodigal Son yeasterday!
Sam_Gamgee
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 25, 2005 06:38
Sam to the Rescue! That's my favorite, just because it shows the courage that is inherent in the hobbits that is brought out in their friendship.
TinaHalfelven
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Post RE: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: March 25, 2005 07:31
"That shiny shirt -grunt- that's mine!" and the"discussion" (more grunting involved than normal). I like the way the orcs talk. It's funny. I really don'tlike Frodo half-naked on the floor. :nono:
Sassyfriend
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Post Re: ROTK Sequence by Sequence #11: The Tower of Cirith Ungol
on: September 20, 2012 11:21
Loved Sam fighting the orcs
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