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firefrostadept
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Post Let's translate quotes
on: August 23, 2004 06:51
Just for practice lets translate quotes. I'll post a quote, or you'll post a quote, around one per week let's say, and try to translate them. I figure it is good practice.

Well, here's the first one.
"A foolish opinion shared by millions is still a foolish opinion." Anon.

PS. Please post who said the quote if it is known.
Malinornë
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: August 28, 2004 01:33
Ok, here's my suggestion:

Alasaila sanwë rimbë sámassen er ná alasaila sanwë.

An unwise thought in many minds is still an unwise thought.
cavear_and_cigarettes
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 01, 2004 04:31
wouldn't it be better to use an adjective instead of rimbë, which is a noun.

perhaps something like this : lissámassen ( I assimilated the n in lin the prefix meaning many, just because it didn't sound right to say) ?
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 01, 2004 07:26
rimbë is the plural of the adjective rimba.

But maybe limbi (plural of limbë) is preferred here, as rimba means something like 'frequent' or 'numerous', which assumes either a time or a countable group.

My quote: Angwenda maltava ná er angwenda.
A chain of gold is still a chain.
Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
cavear_and_cigarettes
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 01, 2004 09:06
whoops :blush:

I didn't pay attention to #'s, I just put it in the dictionary and it came up as a noun :rolling:

oh well.

EDIT::: just looked up limbë in the dictionary, it comes up as an adverb. is this a mistake?

[Edited on 1/9/2004 by cavear_and_cigarettes]
Falagar
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 01, 2004 11:08
Two quotes from the Hitch-hiker's Guide to the Galaxy:

"Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so."
Lúmë ná er olos. Apsalú tantavë sië.
Time is just a vision. Food-time doubly so.

"Life," said Marvin, "Don't talk to me about life."
"Cuilë," equë Marvin, "Áva quetelyen cuilëo"
"Life," said Marvin, "Don't talk to me of life"

[Edited on 1/9/2004 by Falagar]
cavear_and_cigarettes
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 01, 2004 12:34
a big one:

"do all the good you can, by all the means you can, in all the ways you can, in all the places you can, at all the times you can, to all the people you can, as long as you ever can." -John Wesely

also:

"none of us are perfect, but all of us can change." -Dave Severn

I'll be working on them...
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 01, 2004 09:51
A few notes on áva quetelyen.

1) the direct object of quet- is used to denote something that you say e.g. quetin quetta 'I say a word'. So quetelyen would mean that 'I' refers to something that is spoken (this would be ok in a poem, but of course not in daily language).
In this case when you mean 'you talk to me' the word 'me' is an indirect object so it should be in the dative case: quetilyë nin.

2) When using imperatives the verb is an infinitive so it cannot get a normal subject suffix: there are three cases:
- you don't specify the person(s) the order is given to: áva quetë 'don't speak'
- you want to specify that the order is given to a single person, in this case the suffix is -t: áva quetit 'don't you (sing.) speak'
- you want to specify that the order is given to a group, then the suffix is -l: áva quetil 'don't you (plural) speak'

Any other pronouns are added as suffixes to á or áva: ávanin quetë 'don't speak to me' or ávanin quetit 'don't you speak to me'.
Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
Falagar
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 02, 2004 12:40
On the quetilyë nin: noticed that earlier today.

On the imperative: I really should read that chapter again.
Malinornë
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 02, 2004 08:26

EDIT::: just looked up limbë in the dictionary, it comes up as an adverb. is this a mistake?

The source doesn't say what class of word it is, but as "many" to my understanding is an adverb, I'd think the same likely for the Quenya word.

dirk_math, are you sure that limbë has a plural form? Do you think it's an adjective, not an adverb?
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 02, 2004 09:29
If limbë were an adverb, the corresponding adjective would be lin.
This is of course possible in a grammatical way, but not semantically, because the English word 'many' is really an adjective e.g. 'many books'.

It cannot be used as an adverb because in that case English uses 'much' e.g. 'I talk much', 'I sleep much'. 'I talk many' and 'I sleep many' are ungrammatical.
And as for the second role of adverbs, 'many' also cannot be used to intensify an adjective e.g. 'the much appreciated song', again 'the many appreciated song' is ungrammatical.

The English language uses the word 'much' both as adjective and as adverb, but this would be olya and olyavë in Quenya (much books, I sleep much).

In my own personal writings I am using limba as the adjective with limbë as plural. But this is pure speculation in analogy to rimba.
So I propose:
- limba, limbë: adjective 'many', no adverb possible
- rimba, rimbë, rimbavë: adjective 'frequent, numerous', adverb 'frequently'
- olya, olyë, olyavë: adjective 'much', adverb 'much'

Feel free to comment!

Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
cavear_and_cigarettes
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 02, 2004 02:48
Any other pronouns are added as suffixes to á or áva


is this in all occasions?
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 02, 2004 09:28
Yes, but when there is more than one pronoun you get the choice which is added:
Give it to us: can be ámen anta ta or áta anta men
Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
cavear_and_cigarettes
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 03, 2004 05:46
ámen anta ta or áta anta men


I see... so that'd be like the difference between "give to us that" or "give that to us", though technically, both are correct, the latter sounds better.

EDIT:::: does that mean ávanin quetit could be written ávat quete nin? (excuse the lack of diaresis, I'm in a hurry)

[Edited on 3/9/2004 by cavear_and_cigarettes]
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 03, 2004 06:33
The difference is just a question of emphasis:
ámen anta ta: give that to us (and not to anyone else)
áta anta men: give that (and nothing else) to us

ávat quetë nin: is not allowed, the suffixes -t and -l of the imperative are not personal suffixes, they are only markers.
Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 03, 2004 07:53
HOw about the Sam speech. Long. This should be fun.

It’s like in the great stories, Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were, and sometimes you didn’t want to know the end, because how could the end be happy. How could the world go back to the way it was when so much bad happened? But in the end, it’s only a passing thing. This shadow, even darkness must pass.
A new day will come, and when the sun shines it’ll shine out the clearer. Those are the stories that stayed with you, that meant something, even if you were too small to understand why. But I think Mr. Frodo, I do understand. I know now, folk in those stories had lots of chances of turning back only they didn’t. They kept going, because they were holding onto something.

ANd Gandalf's famous quote:

All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us.

And while they're at it, sum1 should translate the whole script!
jks jks
Eruantalincë
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 04, 2004 07:36
Well, Rehadrin...

Why don't you volunteer yourself for the script ?
lindele
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 04, 2004 08:22
Well, I (with the help of others) already translated Gandalf's line. The thread is here.
Lambengolmo
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 04, 2004 06:48
Sorry to tell you this lindele, but your signature needs amending. Later on in that thread, dirk_math and I agreed that antie should rather be antaina.

[Edited on 5/9/2004 by Lambengolmo]
Malinornë
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: September 05, 2004 10:32
Thanks for you input! Here are my thoughts on it:

If limbë were an adverb, the corresponding adjective would be lin.

Or, it could be a basic adverb, not one corresponding to an adjective… but as I now know that it isn't an adverb in English, I no longer think it would be in Quenya
This is of course possible in a grammatical way, but not semantically, because the English word 'many' is really an adjective e.g. 'many books'.

My mistake, I should have checked that! Thank you so much for clearing that up "Many" in my language is classified as a pronoun…
In my own personal writings I am using limba as the adjective with limbë as plural. But this is pure speculation in analogy to rimba.

I'd say that's a rather bold speculation, as the attested form is limbë…. but then I guess one could argue that as Tolkien didn't state it as singular, it could actually be a plural form. The source, Lost Tales 2, discusses the "Gnomish" equivalent, which seems to be used mainly as an ending in the name of groups of peoples… not much help there. But, it makes me curious that in the Etymologies, "-rim" is given as the Noldorin ending for peoples… that is, the same thing that "-lim" (Q. limbë) was used for in Lost Tales 2. So perhaps there's even the possibility that limbë was "replaced" with rimba?

I guess I prefer to use "rimba" for "many" because of how it's presented in the Quenya Course at Ardalambion. It would be interesting to know why Helge decided against "limbë". He calls it "early", but perhaps the reason for his hesitation is also the somewhat odd form, as not many adjectives except for colours end in –ë in singular.
- rimba, rimbë, rimbavë: adjective 'frequent, numerous', adverb 'frequently'

Looks good to me! I hadn't even thought of the adverb, which seems to be a very useful one if we stretch the meaning to include "often"
- olya, olyë, olyavë: adjective 'much', adverb 'much'

I don't have the source for this, PE14, but it seems that both an adjective "olya" and an adverb "olë" for "much" are given. So, the plural form "olyë" makes perfect sense to me, but I'd prefer the attested adverb to your suggested "olyavë". One could of course argue that "olë" is an "old" form and possibly discarded, but in that case it seems to me that the same would be true for "olya" as well.
Feel free to comment!

I'll second that
delalyra
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: December 04, 2004 04:44
I've got one.....
"It is a kingly act to assist the fallen."-Mother Teresa

I haven't finished my quenya lessons, but I'm thinking kingly could be 'act-of-[a]king' so, in the genitive: arano?

I'm not sure how to say 'the fallen' but I know 'fall' is lanta-

I have to say, I love, love this idea!
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: December 05, 2004 12:10
Maybe it doesn't seem like it, but this sentence needs some rather advanced Quenya.

A 'kingly act' gives a property of the act, so the possessive case would be better: cá araneva.

In 'the fallen' we have an adjective that is used as a noun.
But as you noted it is no ordinary adjective but a past participle; and the past participle of lanta- is lantaina. So we find e.g. nér lantaina 'a fallen man'.
The ordinary plural would be: neri lantainë.
But when an adjective is used as a noun we have to use the plural of nouns: i lantainar 'the fallen'.

The final difficulty in this sentence is 'to assist'. This is in Quenya a special construction: the dative of the gerund.
To translate 'assist' I prefer the verb tulpu- 'aid, support'. The gerund of this verb is tulpië and its dative is tulpien.


So your sentence would be: Nas cá araneva tulpien i lantainar.
Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
purplefluffychainsaw
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 03, 2005 06:17
Sam: Istan, nás ilya raicë. Rá vanimarlvë umná sinomë. Mallvë nar. Nás ve mi I alta sinyarnar, Tur Frodo, I minir ya nar melda. Penquanto mornië ar raxë, narmëntë, ar rimbë asarilyë ummerë ista I metya, an manen poluva I metya ná valin? Manen poluva I Ambar ná I mens nanë írë san rimbë faica engwir martanë? Mal mi I metya nás autala engwë, sina nimbë. I mornië autuva. I aurë tuluva, ar írë Anar siluva siluvas ancalima. Sinar narnë I sinyarnar ya nortanë aslyë, ya mapanëlyë, ailyë istanë manan, var lá. Mal sana, Tur Frodo, istanën manan. Lië mi sina sinyamar haryanë rimbë asari írëntë polnë pelë, malntë alanë. Lelyanëntë apa, an hempëntë ma.
Frodo: Mana narlvë hepa, Sam?
Sam: I vanima mi sina Ambar, ar nás valda an mahtalvë ans.

Sam: I know, it’s all wrong. For rights we should not be here. But we are. It’s like in the great stories, master Frodo, the ones that are beloved. Full of darkness and danger they are, and many times you don’t want to know the end, for how can the end be happy? How can the world be the way it was when so many bad things happened? But in the end it’s a passing thing, this sadness. The darkness will pass. The day will come, and when the sun shines it will shine brighter. Those were the stories that stayed with you, that seized you, if you knew why or not. But I think, master Frodo, I know why. People in those stories had many times when they could have returned, but they did not. They travelled on, for they were holding something.
Frodo: What are we holding, Sam?
Sam: The good in this world, and it’s worthy for us to fight for it.

What d'ye think, Rehadrin? I had to play with it a bit, but I think I got there, eventually... **chuckles** What a way to spend the last day of the holidays!

Right, someone have a go at this (A nice short easy one):

Each of us is born under a star, be it bright and shining, or dark and fated.
~ Brian Jacques, Outcast of Redwall.

I did start to do it, once upon a time, but it was before I joined Councilofelrond, and I couldn't work out how to do born, and it wasn't on any of the dictronaries I had... It might be on the Councilofelrond one, I haven't looked.
Malinornë
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 06, 2005 03:16
purplefluffychainsaw, it's great to see your enthusiasm and I understand that you've put a lot of work into this translation! Unfortunately, it has lots of problems, and I hope you (and other readers) will find my comments helpful, rather than criticising. We're here to learn, myself included, so I make no pretence to know Quenya perfectly. But I've studied its grammar a bit deeper than you have.

This commentary will be rather lengthy, so I'm going to do it in parts, a little at a time. But before I start, a general comment:

When translating, it's necessary to be aware of idioms, expressions that are used in one language but lose their meanings if translated word by word to another. The meaning is the important thing to carry over to the other language, not each individual word. E.g. "it's all wrong" can't be translated literally to even my language, Swedish, although it's closely related to English.

When working from a dictionary, it's also important to make sure to pick the right kind of word, e.g. when translating "end", do we want the verb "to end" or the noun "an end"? Those are totally different word in Quenya, though they happen to look the same in English.

That said, I've added some comments to each line, and afterwards, my suggested translation (which, by no means is 100 % perfect or the only possible way of doing it!).

Sam: Istan, nás ilya raicë. Rá vanimarlvë umná sinomë. Mallvë nar.
Sam: I know, it’s all wrong. For rights we should not be here. But we are.

-lvë can only be used with verbs, not adjectives (vanima) or conjunctions (mal). Um- is a verb meaning "is not" in itself, so it can't be be added to "ná". "rá" means "on behalf of" and "vanimar" means "fair, beautiful ones".

My suggestion: Istan, ilya ná raica. Martolva umë sinomë. Mal nalvë sinomë.
Literally: I know, everything is wrong. Our fate is not in this place. But we are here.

It’s like in the great stories, Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered.
Nás ve mi I alta sinyarnar, Tur Frodo, I minir ya nar melda.
It’s like in the great stories, master Frodo, the ones that are beloved.


- "mi" does mean "in", but Quenya generally prefers to use cases instead of prepositons. The locative case is used for "in" here.
- alta needs to be plural as it describes a plural word (stories)
- for "the ones", it's possible to use just the adjective. "minë" is just the number "one" and it doesn't have a plural form.
- if we want a construction with "nar", then melda needs to be plural "meldë"
The adjective "valdëa"(important.... from PE12) can probably be used to get across "really mattered" here. If we keep "beloved ones", then "meldar".
- One of the Sindarin translations for the name Frodo is "Taur" (great, mighty), so it might be possible to use the corresponding Quenya form, taura, or turn it more obviously into a name: Tauron. But I kept "Frodo" here!

Vë i altë quentassen, heru Frodo. I valdëar.
Like in the big stories, master Frodo. The important ones.

Full of darkness and danger they were, and sometimes you didn’t want to know the end,
Penquanto mornië ar raxë, narmëntë, ar rimbë asarilyë ummerë ista I metya,
Full of darkness and danger they are, and many times you don’t want to know the end,


- using genitive with "(pen)quanta" means that the substance something is full of gets the genitive ending
- the past tense of "ná/nar" is believed to be "né/ner"
- the partitive plural (formed with "li") can be used to indicate the unspecified number in "sometimes". The locative case is used for time.
- when using the negative verb um-, the pronoun (-lyë) is added to this verb, and the word it applies to (mer-) is in the infinitive. Metya- is a verb, so it can't be used for "end" in this sense

Quantë mornio ar raxëo nentë, ar lúmelissen úmelyë merë ista i metta.
Full of darkness and danger they were, and at some times you didn't want to know the end.

because how could the end be happy.
an manen poluva I metya ná valin?
for how can the end be happy?

- pol- means "can" in the sense "to be physically able to", so I prefer to avoid it here, which also solves the problem with the unknown infinitive form "be". "nauva" is the future tense (will be). Same comment as before on "metya-". It is a verb.

an manen i metta nauva valin?
for how will the end be happy?


[Edited on 6/1/2005 by Malinornë]
Malinornë
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 09, 2005 09:39
Some ideas on the next part:

How could the world go back to the way it was when so much bad happened?
Manen poluva i Ambar ná I mens nanë írë san rimbë faica engwir martanë?
How can the world be the way it was when so many bad things happened?


- same problem with "be" as in the previous line, so a simple solution would be to use "nauva" instead for the construction with pol-
- "the way" doesn't mean "the road" here, so it can't be translated literally. "like it was" would be an acceptable rewrite
- marta- seems to require an impersonal construction, which seems a bit complicated here, so I'd just reword to avoid it

Manen i Ambar nauva vë neryë, írë ilyë úcari sinë carnë?How will the world be like it was, when all these bad deeds are done?

But in the end, it’s only a passing thing. This shadow, even darkness must pass.
Mal mi I metya nás autala engwë, sina nimbë. I mornië autuva.
But in the end it’s a passing thing, this sadness. The darkness will pass.


- same comment on "mi" and "metya-"... mi could be used, but metya- is a verb
- I'm hesitant about translating "a passing thing" literally, so again I prefer to reword
- "sina" is placed after the noun it determines, and Quenya has many words for "shadow", so I think one can be used here
- to express "must", we can use a construction with "mauya-" (compel; impersonal, so the thing that has to do something is in the dative case).

Mal i mettassë autuvaryë. Mauya huinë sinan, ar i mornien yando, auta.
But in the end it will pass. This shadow, and the darkness also, must pass.

A new day will come, and when the sun shines it’ll shine out the clearer.
I aurë tuluva, ar írë Anar siluva siluvas ancalima.
The day will come, and when the sun shines it will shine brighter
.

- Here, I'd just add "vinya" for "new"
EDIT: - dirk_math just pointed out that according to the material published in PE14, we can make comparatives by adding -lda, so "brighter" would be "calimalda". (this comes from a grammar for 'old' Quenya, but as we don't know how to form the comparative in 'modern' Quenya, we might as well use what we have )

Those are the stories that stayed with you, that meant something,
Sinar narnë I sinyarnar ya nortanë aslyë, ya mapanëlyë,
Those were the stories that stayed with you, that seized you


- again, we put "sina" after "stories" (I prefer to reword some things)
- "with you" would be "aselyë" - "sl" is not a possible consonant combination in Quenya

Quentar sinë marner mi le, ya mapanelyë,
These stories abode in you that seized you

even if you were too small to understand why.
ailyë istanë manan, var lá.
if you knew why or not.


- good idea to reword this! We don't have a satisfactory way to express "even if, although"
- the ending for "you" needs to be on the verb, and ista- has an irregular past tense form, so "ai sintel" (if you knew).

But I think Mr. Frodo, I do understand. I know now,
Mal sana, Tur Frodo, istanën manan.
But I think, master Frodo, I know why.


- we need an ending for "I" -> "sanan" (I think), istan (I know), hanyan (I understand)
- there's an understood "that" in the English sentence that needs to be expressed in Quenya -> sa (I think that I know/understand).
- present tense is probably better than aorist if we use "now" (Istëan sí - I know now)

folk in those stories had lots of chances of turning back only they didn’t.
Lië mi sina sinyamar haryanë rimbë asari írëntë polnë pelë, malntë alanë.
People in those stories had many times when they could have returned, but they did not.


- as "lië" means "people" in the sense "kin, house", I'd try "queni" (some people) instead
- we have a word for "that", so let's use it (also after the word it determines)
- "had many times" is probably better not translated literally

Queni quentar tanassen rimbë lússen poller auta márenna, mal úmentë auta.
People in those stories on many occasions were able to go home, but they did not go.


[Edited on 16/1/2005 by Malinornë]
purplefluffychainsaw
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 10, 2005 03:30
**Jotes down notes happily** No proplems, the whole reason I posted on here was because I realised I'd got as far as I was going to get translating for myself and I needed someone to give me some ideas where to work on. Thank-you!
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 11, 2005 08:33
I'm happy you took it that way!

If you'd like to have a more "systematic" walk-through of the grammar, I suggest the Quenya Workbook (under "Languages" in the main menu). That would also give you the opportunity to translate sentences with gradually increasing difficulty, instead of getting to all complications straight away.
Malinornë
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 11, 2005 08:49

Each of us is born under a star, be it bright and shining, or dark and fated.
~ Brian Jacques, Outcast of Redwall.


Here's my suggestion for this:

Ilya erdë ná nóna nu elen, mai calima ar sílala, var morna ar marta.
Each person is born under a star, if bright and shining, or dark and fated.
kellidra
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 13, 2005 11:29
OK, here is my first quote translation. It is one of my favorite quotes.

"When I get a little money, I buy books. If anything is left, I buy food and clothing." -- Desiderius Erasmus

And now, after a little help from Dirk_Math, here is my translation.

Írë haryan auteli, netin parmar; mai erë qua, netin matil ar vailë. —Desiderius Erasmus

I chose to use "harya" instead of "net" to translate the first "get", simply because I wanted to avoid the repetition. I think the meaning is not really changed. Also, I chose to leave out the "there is" (ëa) in favor if "if anything remains". I hope my choice of aorist for the verbs was correct. Thanks!

kellidra
kellidra
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 13, 2005 11:45
Here's one more, and perhaps you'll find it interesting. Just a bit of background, though. As I mentioned in another post, in high school I began working on my own language to go with a fantasy world a friend and I had created. When I later learned that Tolkien had made his own languages, I became fascinated with his work and thus fell in love with LoTR.

Here is a blessing from my language, originally called Xavionite (the stories of Xavion have sadly fallen by the wayside--not by my choice--so I may use it with a new name in stories of a different world), and then my translation into Quenya.

Tyal Shonyo vostno mahyorit kad vyem tasirit estreno malara.

Nai Éru listyuva le ar tiruva le illumë

kellidra
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 16, 2005 08:27
Great quotes, Kellidra! That's very interesting with your own language, and great to see an example of it
Tari_Niphredil
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 20, 2005 01:40
HI Kellidra! Good job with your quotes, but I had some problems with the translations. Since Malinornë didn't see any problems, it's probably me, so I claim ignorance and lack of memory for it.

But in your first quote by Erasmus, I don't know where you got erë qua from. I looked in all my dictionaries, but I fear I must have forgotten something about that. Even though you said you used that instead ëa, but I haven't a clue what you placed instead of it.

In your second quote, you used listyuva, and I couldn't find a translation for the verb you used. I couldn't find it anywhere, so maybe listya is a typo, or did you make it up?

Thank you.
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 20, 2005 10:36
First question: erë is the aorist of the verb er- "remain"
(it does look a little bit strange because not that many verbs start with a vowel, but it is completely regular)

Second question: There are a lot of words in Parma Eldalamberon 12 (PE12) that come from Qenya an older form of the Quenya language.
Some authors (as e.g. Fauskanger) don't include these in their word-lists as they are reluctant that these words are genuine Quenya. But I on the other hand, think that most of these words are valid as I don't think Tolkien would have changed the whole vocabulary between Qenya and Quenya.
So that is why these words are included in a new word list that can be downloaded from this website (and also because PE12 is not widely available):
http://www.councilofelrond.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Content&file=index&action=ViewContent&cid=6

A small note on this word-list: some words have a stem-form in PE12 and not in the word-list on Ardalambion, in that case I prefer the stem form because most words in the Ardalambion list are based upon one example only. So if we have a document by Tolkien himself in which he uses this stem-form I personally will use the stem-form and not the form in the Ardalambion word-list.
To give an example: nat "thing" has stem-form natt- in PE12, so e.g. its genitive would be natto (instead of nato).
Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
kellidra
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 21, 2005 09:26
Hi, Tari_Niphredil,

Dirk explained the answers to your two questions. I thought I should provide an English translation of my second quote.
Listya means "bless." The quote should be translated, "May God bless you and keep you forever" (in my language, it is literally, "May God bless you and keep you for all time").

Dirk, could you answer one more question? Is there a dual form of "you"? In the stories I have written, that quote is frequently used as a wedding blessing and therefore, if a dual form exists, it would be the natural to use it here.

All the best,

kellidra
dirk_math
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Post RE: Let's translate quotes
on: January 21, 2005 10:32
I don't think there is a dual form of "you". But I would use le yúyo (you both).

Greetings,
Dirk
Yassë engë lómë, anarties calali.
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