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atalante_star
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Post Turgon, Morgoth and Gondolin
on: May 25, 2007 12:31
It says in the Sil:

"Now the thought of Morgoth dwelt ever upon Turgon; for Turgon had escaped him, of all his foes that one whom he most desired to take or to destroy. And that thought troubled him, and marred his victory, for Turgon of the mighty house of Fingolfin was now by right King of all the Noldor; and Morgoth feared and hated the house of Fingolfin, because they had the friendship of Ulmo his foe, and because of the wounds that Fingolfin gave him with his sword. And most of all his kin Morgoth feared Turgon; for of old in Valinor his eye had lighted upon him, and whenever he drew near a shadow had fallen on his spirit, foreboding that in some time that yet lay hidden, from Turgon ruin should come to him."


I've always wondered about this ...

Why *Turgon*? There were bigger and baddies members of the Noldor out there to worry about.

Was it Turgon he was worried about, or actually Gondolin (which happened to have Turgon in charge)?

And why was Morgoth getting foreshadowings anyway?
Ilandir
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Post RE: Turgon, Morgoth and Gondolin
on: May 25, 2007 06:17
Why *Turgon*?
Precisely because of Gondolin. Obviously Morgoth didn't know anything about it but the fact that Turgon remained hidden from him and was afraid of what he might reveal. All the other Noldor captains had already openly showed their power.

And why was Morgoth getting foreshadowings anyway?
Well, the way I see it is that he was a fallen Valar and slowly he was losing his power. I guess this foreshadowing (some sort of sixth sense) was part of his initial power (supposely being the greatest of all the Valar) until it finally disappeared at a later stage.

[Edited on 25/5/2007 by Ilandir]

[Edited on 25/5/2007 by Ilandir]
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Naurmaethor
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Post RE: Turgon, Morgoth and Gondolin
on: May 25, 2007 07:01
Well I read this recently also and thought the same thing. First thing I thought of was that someone of Turgon's lineage would cause Morgoth's downfall and so I looked it up and sure enough Turgon's daughter Idrial married Tuor and they both had Earendil! Who we all know sailed in Vingilot to Aman and pleaded with the Valar to have mercy on both men and elves and afterwards the War of Wrath ensued which ended with Morgoth locked in the void.
Still round the corner there may wait a new road or a secret gate: and though I oft have passed them by, a day will come at last when I shall take the hidden paths that run west of the moon, east of the sun.
cirdaneth
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Post RE: Turgon, Morgoth and Gondolin
on: May 25, 2007 10:27
That’s what I think, too, Naurmaethor! The Valar invited the Elves to Aman to protect them from Melkor thus inflaming his hatred of them and of Finwe who led the Long Journey from Cuivienen. To spite the Valar he aimed at the destruction of Finwe’s line. He almost succeeded, so perhaps he sensed then that his downfall would come through Turgon, but couldn’t guess how. The other instrument in this was Galadriel. I wonder if he underestimated her because she was a woman.
golden_lorien
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Post RE: Turgon, Morgoth and Gondolin
on: June 14, 2007 03:31
Precisely because of Gondolin. Obviously Morgoth didn't know anything about it but the fact that Turgon remained hidden from him and was afraid of what he might reveal. All the other Noldor captains had already openly showed their power.
I agree. I think Morgoth, like anyone else, is afraid of the unknown... especially when the unknown is a powerful hidden city ruled by one of Finwe's blood. As long a Gondolin stood, he would know fear. At least, that's how I see it.

[Edited on 15/6/2007 by golden_lorien]
cirdaneth
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Post RE: Turgon, Morgoth and Gondolin
on: June 17, 2007 10:39
... especially when the unknown is a powerful hidden city ruled by one of Finwe's blood. As long a Gondolin stood, he would know fear. At least, that's how I see it.


You're right. Morgoth has sensed his doom in that House, and because he thinks only in terms of might and strength, he sees the threat from Finwe's bloodline in that sense. Thus he seeks to destroy the stronghold and the armies. He has not sensed that his doom will be sealed by Turgon's grandson, Earendil, not in strength of arms, but through a long and risky voyage, and the devotion of his wife.
cirdaneth
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Post Re: Turgon, Morgoth and Gondolin
on: November 23, 2012 09:23
*bump
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