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tarcolan
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Post How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: February 25, 2012 10:24
Sorry to drag this one up again. About 18 months ago I asked how many times Frodo had used the Ring in the Shire, as I thought it important, and I still do. What bothers me now is how Gandalf and Galadriel knew he had used it. What say you?
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starofdunedain
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Post RE: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: February 25, 2012 02:09
Because both Galadriel and Gandalf wore rings of power, I'm assuming they could tell when the one ring was being used. I'm not sure how many time Frodo used the ring in the Shire, once in Bree, once on Weathertop for sure.
tarcolan
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Post RE: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: February 25, 2012 02:53
The original thread 'How many times...' was posted in July 2010 but seems to have been truncated, I wonder why?
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cirdaneth
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Post RE: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: February 26, 2012 02:06
I've bumped the old thread, Tarcolan, so that we can continue this discussion there. I don't think it's truncated. It finishes with our last exchange, and after that nobody commented. Good to see it rejuvenated.
PotbellyHairyfoot
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Post RE: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: February 29, 2012 05:30
What gets me puzzled is that the ring apparently had a more pronounced effect when Frodo used it as compared to when Bilbo used it. When Bilbo used it at the long-expected Party he seemed to have a cavalier attitude about it and it was reported that others had seen him reach into his pocket and disappear, as though it was merely a cloak of invisibility. Bilbo never mentioned the other realm or the searching eye that Frodo saw when he put on the ring.
tarcolan
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Post RE: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: March 01, 2012 12:46
Bilbo didn't actually say anything about his experience with the Ring, and he had no reason to think it was anything more than a handy little trinket. Gandalf tells Frodo that any magic ring is perilous to mortals (I think) so I'm sure he would have warned Bilbo off it.Perhaps the Ring was only just waking up at this time. Or it could even be Tolkien's awakening to the necessary potency of the Ring as he wrote the story.

We aren't told anything about Frodo's use of the Ring before he leaves, but despite Gandalf's warning he did use it, but I don't believe more than once or twice. It seems that the presence of the ringwraiths wakes the Ring up, calling to Frodo in the Shire and even more so at Weathertop, but still with no sense of a diminished visual world or vision of another world. It's only on Amon Hen that the full effects are described, presumably due to the proximity to Mordor.

As to the original question; I'd like to think that the keepers of the Three would be aware when the One Ring was used, star, but they'd have been aware when Gollum and Bilbo used it and they weren't. So did Frodo tell Gandalf and he tell Galadriel?
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PotbellyHairyfoot
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Post RE: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: March 02, 2012 08:07
I thought I had an answer as it is stated in The Silmarillion chapter, Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age, that Sauron was immediately perceived once he placed the Ring on his finger. However, that cannot be said of Bilbo, or even of Gollum, or the wearers of the Three, and the Nazgul, would have known that the One had been found.
Perhaps there was a relationship between the innate power of the wearer and the his detectability. Bilbo and Gollum may have only caused a disruption that was only detectable over the background 'noise' and the wearers of the three finally realized what it was once they found out that the One had been found.
RangerStryder
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Post Re: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: March 12, 2012 02:20
Quote from tarcolan on February 25, 2012, 20:24
Sorry to drag this one up again. About 18 months ago I asked how many times Frodo had used the Ring in the Shire, as I thought it important, and I still do. What bothers me now is how Gandalf and Galadriel knew he had used it. What say you?


There's no indication in the book that Frodo used (put it on his finger) the One Ring inside the Shire but touching it (taking it out from the envelope and adding a chain) happened a lot of times.

Putting on the One Ring outside the Shire = 4X.



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tarcolan
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Post Re: How did they know Frodo had used the Ring?
on: March 13, 2012 03:35
RangerStryder wrote
There's no indication in the book that Frodo used (put it on his finger) the One Ring inside the Shire...
In the companion thread cirdaneth mentions Galadriel's words to Frodo, which is one clue. The other is Gandalf's letter in which he says "PS Do NOT use It again! not for any reason whatever!". I'd thought this was discussed in the other thread but apparently not. To me these two clues can only mean that Frodo used the Ring in the Shire, but whether he did or no I can't believe Tolkien would have Gandalf and Galadriel just guessing, however shrewdly.

PotbellyHairfoot, I like the idea that the keepers of the Three had sensed something which only resolved itself once they knew the ring was the One. The problem is that Gandalf knew when Bilbo had used the Ring, at least on his adventure, and could have correlated these times with whatever fuzzy feeling he was getting. Mind you, he was a bit busy at the time.
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