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LadyMeg
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Post Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 30, 2003 07:41
Aiya to All,

To stop confusion in the Elvish 101 section (Sindarin) we will be having a Quenya word of the Week, placed in here and the Sindarin word of the Week will be in Elvish 101.

Since it is my turn to have a word of the week, please correct me if I am wrong and my sentence for errors much appreciated. LOL!


The Word Of The Week Is;

BROKEN : rácina

All my arrows are broken

ilya pilindinya ná rácina


nostalë almië - LadyMeg

Lady_Lorwen
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 30, 2003 07:55
Great word Lady Meg!
I don't know very much Quenya, so I can't write a sentence, but this will definatly be added to my vocbulary!
Meldon
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 30, 2003 08:36
Good work LadyMeg.
Just about the sentence though
ilya pilindinya ná rácina

**pilindinya doesn't work for 'my arrows' (at least I'm pretty sure that it doesn't) When you add both a posessive ending AND a plural marker to a noun, the posessive ending comes first.
So _pilin_ 'arrow' > _pilininya_ 'my arrow' > _pilininyar_ 'my arrows'
In this case, the ending -nya uses the -i- as a connecting vowel to avoid **pilinnya

Another thing, remember that the adjectives which describe nouns agree in number with the noun that they describe.
So you can't have:
**ilya pilininyar ná rácina
The adjectives have to agree in number, so you get:
_ilyë pilininyar nar rácinë_
Also notice, that _ná_'is' becomes _nar_'are' because it is now the verb of a plural noun.
I hope that makes some sense to you


Another note for the more advanced Quenyarists. The Ardalambion dictionary quotes the plural of 'pilin' 'arrow' to be 'pilindi' 'arrows'. What I though, was that the connecting vowel used with the ending _-nya_, which is _-i-_, is the same as the plural marker for _pilin_ also _-i_.
So if the plural of _pilin_ is _pilindi_ should this _-d-_ which is now sheilded by the longer ending show through in the case of 'my arrow' eg _pilindinya_ or 'my arrows' _pilindinyar_?? My thoughts are, that it probably should. What do you guys think?? I'll leave it as _pilininyar_ above, just so it complies with the rules set out in the Ardalambion Course.
Let me know what you think.
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 30, 2003 09:14
Quick thought on pilin: (without access to notes, so I´ll have to correct later if it makes no sense )

Could we perhaps assume that pilind- would be the stem form of pilin? That would be an explanation for the plural pilindi and then it would be "pilindinyar" as you suggest.

EDIT: Yes, pilind- should be the stem form, so “my arrows” would indeed be “pilindinyar”. Otherwise, we probably wouldn´t see **pilininyar, but rather the contracted form **pilinyar.
This does not contradict the information given in Lesson 3 (stem variation) and Lesson 14 (possessive pronominal endings and connecting vowels).

And a small comment on rácina:
There seems to be two similar words , the adjective racina (short a), and the passive participle rácina (lenghened stem vowel). It may not be possible to use the participle in the construction A is B. (discussed in the end of lesson 10)

[Edited on 2/4/2003 by Malinornë]
LadyMeg
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 30, 2003 11:33
Aiya Meldon,

Is this correct hantalye for Thankyou? I do really appreciate all the help you give me and you make perfect sense

Also Malinornë I also Thankyou for your help and assistance and appreciate it very much :love:

nostalë almië - LadyMeg
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 31, 2003 09:37
Heres my sentence for the word of the week:

I rácina macil Elendilo nauva envinyanta.

(The broken sword of Elendil will be renewed.)
Cenerue
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 31, 2003 11:50
Are we all supposed to come up with sentences for the word of the week? Not that I'd mind, it would be fun.
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: March 31, 2003 08:32
Yep, Cenerue, everyone who wants to is very welcome to post a sentence for the word of the week. (You can read more about how it´s supposed to work in Lady_Lorwen´s post in the main forum. PM her if you want to suggest a word of the week as well.)
Manian
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 01, 2003 10:57
I knew that word already. But I really liked your example!
Cenerue
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 04, 2003 11:29
I orco aldamo ná rácina. Is that right for "the orc's back is broken?"
Meldon
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 04, 2003 02:09
Aiya!!
Is this correct hantalye for Thankyou?

No, not really. If we are assuming that the reconstructed verb _hanta-_ does in fact mean 'to thank' (I do think that _hanta-_ is usable)
Then you could say _hanta-nye-l_ _hantanyel_ 'Thank I you'
or 'I thank you' Remember, that the first pronominal ending to be added to a word always denotes the subject not the object, so _hantalyë_ would be 'you thank'
If you didn't want to include the 'I' in the sentence, I'm pretty sure that you could say _hanta le_ using the independent pronoun instead of the suffix.

I hope that helps a bit.

Namárië meldonya
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 06, 2003 09:04
Week #2

The Quenya word of this week is: hresta (shore, beach)

Hostanyë hyalmar i hrestassë.
I gather sea-shells on the shore.
LadyMeg
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 06, 2003 03:17
Aiya,

WEEK #2

Still learning Quenya and I know that I just don't seem to get the sentence structure properly, I hope I get it right soon :cry:

Please correct my spelling mistakes! Which I am sure I will have a lot of

Listening to the waves, on the beach.

lasta an i falmalinnar, or i hresta


nostalë almië - LadyMeg
Meldon
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 06, 2003 07:56
Aiya
LadyMeg: I've had a long day, so I don't really have enough time to comment on your whole sentence, but the last half
**or i hresta means 'over the beach'. I think you need to use either the locative or the allative case. I'm pretty sure that they are interchangable in this context, so you could have either _i hrestanna_ or _i hrestassë_ for on the beach.

My sentence:
Vantanyë i hrestanna tienen
'I walk to the beach by means of the path'

Namárië
I'm going to bed now!!
Quesseriël
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 13, 2003 03:05
Even though its still Sunday in my part of the world, I'm posting the new word of the week for all those that live...somewhere else .

Week #3
carmë - art, making, production

i carmë vanya.
The art is beautiful.
LadyMeg
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 13, 2003 07:23
Aiya,

Here is my sentence for #Week 3:

Flower art looks lovely in the dish.
lotsë Carmë elar melwa mí venë

namárië - LadyMeg
Cenerue
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 14, 2003 12:10
Vanima Carme care órenya linda
Beautiful Art makes my heart sing
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 16, 2003 09:45
LadyMeg, I noticed that Meldon has only commented on the second part of your “beach” sentence, so here´s some more:

Listening to the waves, on the beach.
Lasta an i falmalinnar, or i hresta.
Lastala i falmar, i hrestassë.

“Lastala” is the active participle, which would probably be the best choice here, as this sounds a bit like a phrase from a poem. …, listening to…. “Falmar” is plural of “falma” – “falmalinnar” would mean something like “upon (many) waves” (allative case).
I agree that “hrestanna” would also be possible here, but perhaps there might be a small difference between them: I´d use “hrestassë” to accentuate that the person listening is on the beach, and “hrestanna” to accentuate that the waves are breaking against the beach. Does it make sense?

**

Flower art looks lovely in the dish.
Lotse Carmë elar melwa mí venë.
Lotsecarmë ná melwa mí venë.

I would combine “lotsë” and “Carmë” to a compound word. “Ela” is the imperative form of the verb, used to tell people to do something, like Look! See! It might be better to just use “is” instead. Or reword the sentence to “Flower art is lovely seen in the dish – in that case we could use “cenna”, the passive participle of “cen-“ (to see).

**

Cenerue, I´m not fully convinced we can use “car-“ for “make” in this sense. Perhaps it would be better to use “ora-“ (urge, impel) instead. Just an idea

**

And finally, my sentence:

Cuilë ná sinta, Carmë ná anda.
Life is short, but art is long. (Vita brevis, ars longa.)

[Edited on 17/4/2003 by Malinornë]
Mirlomien
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 21, 2003 09:18
Week #4

Elen "star"

as in Frodo's greeting "elen síla lúmenn' omentielvo"

(ya'll forgive me for not writing my own sentence!)
Falagar
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 21, 2003 11:08
I eleni sílar vë ninqui míri
The stars are shining like white jewels.
Cenerue
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 21, 2003 01:32
Rocconya varne harya ninque elen nengwesse
My brown horse has a white star on the nose


Would this be correct?
Vanima Carme ora órenya linda
Beautiful Art makes my heart sing

Or would it be "ore" for aorist?
LadyMeg
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 21, 2003 03:48
Aiya,

Here is my sentence;

The Stars brilliantly shine in the night skies

I eleni alcarinquar cala mí lómë fanyarë

Namarie - LadyMeg
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: April 22, 2003 11:01
Cenerue,

Rocconya varne harya ninque elen nengwesse.
My brown horse has a white star on the nose.

Great! Just a small comment: though it´s not exactly wrong to place the adjective after the noun it describes, the preferred variant seems to be to put it before the noun, as in English. Perhaps it would be good to add the article “i” for “the nose”.

Vanima Carme ora orenya linda
Beautiful Art makes my heart sing.

Hmmm, perhaps my suggestion wasn´t that good… Yes, it would be “orë” for aorist, but it´s also an impersonal verb, rather meaning “it impels for me” (“for me” = dative), so to use it we´ll have to reword the sentence a bit:

Irë cenin vanima Carmë orë órenyan linda.
When I see beautiful art it impels for my heart to sing.

***
LadyMeg,

I eleni alcarinquar cala mí lómë fanyarë.
The stars brilliantly shine in the night skies
I eleni silir alcarinquavë mí lómëo fanyarë.

“sil-“ is the normal word for “shine” when referring to the Moon or stars. “Brilliantly” is an adverb, so we need to add the ending –ve to the adjective: alcarinquavë (doesn´t sound that good, does it? "Calimavë" (brightly) is another suggestion. night skies = skies of the night, so I´ve added the genitive ending –o to “lomë”.

***

Ter sarë lúmi i elennar.
Through bitter times to the stars. (Per aspera ad astra.)

And a quote from TTT:
Aiya Eärendil elenion ancalima!
Hail Eärendil brightest of stars!

[Edited on 23/4/2003 by Malinornë]
*Belaraniel*
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 06, 2003 02:02
I am so sorry!! I couldn't get to my computer yesterday, so I'm a day late for word of the week!!! :cry::cry: Well here's my word.

Mahtar>>> warrior

I am not taking quenya so i don't know how to make a sentence sorry!!!!!! PLease forgive me for being late!!!
LadyMeg
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 06, 2003 11:30
Aiya to all,

Here is my sentence hope it hasn't got to many errors!

The Warriors strength stopped the Orc army.
I mahtai tuo pustar i orco hossë.

Namárië - LadyMeg
Lady_Lorwen
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 12, 2003 11:17
Week #1
"ora"-urge

I'm not advance enough to write a sentence yet, sorry:blush:
mireandune
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 12, 2003 05:03
Fairly new at this myself, but let's try:

The urge to find the treasure was great.
I ora hirë i harma altaina.


(Hmm.. not sure about "altaina" for "was great"...)
LadyMeg
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 12, 2003 10:37
Aiya to All,

Week#1.

I am not sure if this sentence is correct, please correct me if I am wrong!

The commander urging many troops uphill.
I cáno hortalë limbë hossi ambapenda.

Namárië - LadyMeg
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 15, 2003 08:46
The word of this week is rather tricky, “ora-“ is not the noun “an urge”, but the verb “to urge, to impel, to move), and it is used as an impersonal construction, meaning that the subject of the English sentence will be in the dative case in Quenya:

Ora nin matë i lissë yávë.
I would like to eat the sweet fruit. (literally: “It impels for me to eat the sweet fruit”)

Mireandune, “altaina” looks like an adjective with an ending usually seen in passive participles… I don´t think we´re allowed to do that A possible (but unattested) word for “was” is “né” (plural “ner”).
Welcome to the Quenya forum - we´re happy to have you here! If you like, you can introduce yourself in the thread "Mana ná esselya" (What´s your name) (it´s at the top of page 2)

LadyMeg, “hortalë” is a verbal noun meaning “urging” as a process, so I´d suggest using the active participle “hortala” instead. And meldonya… you forgot to use the word of the week, which is “ora-“

And a comment on your sentence for last week´s word, mahtar:
I mahtai tuo pustar i orco hossë.
The warriors strengh stopped the Orc army.

I´d use the possesive here to express “the strength of the warriors” as a characteristic: “i tuo mahtariva” and also for “the army of orcs”: “i nossë orcoiva” (the army consists of, and/or belong to orcs). “Stopped” would be the past tense: pustanë.

[Edited on 16/5/2003 by Malinornë]
mireandune
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 16, 2003 11:47
Hantalë, Malinornë.
Can't do that, huh? Oops.
I guess I saw the one little sentence in Helge's course that said that a passive participle was an "adjectival derivative" but missed the following entire paragraph that discussed the fact that it applied to verbs. :blush: (Note to self: Re-read binder. Again.)
LadyMeg
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 17, 2003 09:30
Aiya ilquen,

Here is the Word of the Week#2.

OVERCAST lúrëa (dark)

The morning skies are overcast today.
I arin fanyarë nar lúrëa sinarë.

Namárie - LadyMeg


[Edited on 20/5/2003 by LadyMeg]
Corintur_Linyacelu
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 18, 2003 12:04
Hi,
I am new here, so excuse my nescience... what's this "word of the week" about? Somebody takes some word every week and proclames it to be the "word of the week"...?
So that you can (slowly) improve your vocabulary?
Would somebody be so kind and explain it a newbie like I am?

Btw: I would prefer something like "sina aurë" (lit.: this day) for "today", because "ana-" denotes "to, towards" and "today" doesn't mean anything like approaching the day (moving "to, towards" it).
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 18, 2003 06:29
Hi Corintur!
Yes, the purpose of this is to improve vocabulary. The "Word of the Week" was "invented" by Lady_Lorwen and at first the idea was just to present one word each week, nothing more. Then we discovered that it was also a neat way to practice writing sentences, so that´s what we´re doing now. If you want to post a word of the week, send a PM to Lady_Lorwen, and she´ll PM you when its your turn.

Good ideas on "today"! Would just put "sina" after "aurë".

LadyMeg, here are some more comments on your sentence:
"fanyarë" is singular in Quenya, and for "morning" here, I think we could use the adjective "arinya" (then we don´t have to think about case endings for "arin") So I´d write the whole sentence as: I arinya fanyarë ná lurëa aurë sina.

[Edited on 19/5/2003 by Malinornë]
Corintur_Linyacelu
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 19, 2003 01:32
Ah okay... thats a nice idea
Even if Quenya vocabulary is not complete, it's a lot of words, though...

And "aure sina" is better, true
Malinornë
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Post RE: Word Of The Week in Quenya
on: May 19, 2003 04:54
I lurië lumbor unduláver i vilya.
The dark clouds covered the sky.
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