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Jemima

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 05, 2004 03:41

Charis - sounds like you have a cool (and wise) youth leader!

I think it's interesting how Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli didn't recognize Gandalf at first after his return. It reminds me of how the disciples and others didn't recognize Jesus at first after His resurrection. For one thing they didn't expect to see him. He also was different somehow and yet the same. I like in the book how Tolkien said Gandalf appeared to have a light shining out from within him at that point.

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 05, 2004 09:23

Boy, Jemima, I never thought about it that way, about Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli on recognizing Gandalf and putting it in the same meaning as the disciples and the others not recognize Jesus after His resurrection. Also Mary Magdalene thought Jesus was the gardener when she first saw him. (John 20:15). Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli thought Gandalf was Saruman. that's so neet

. Thanks, Jemima, for pointing that out

.
There's another one that just crossed my mind. After the Ring was destroyed, Frodo and Sam was running for their lives. When they were, sort of, safe Frodo had a sudden look of relief on his face. Then softly he says, "It's Gone!". I can remember the relief I felt after I excepted Christ into my heart. After A while I finally said to a friend, "I'm saved!". I had tears in my eyes and a wide smile

on my face.

Jemima

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 08, 2004 02:22

I felt the same way when I accepted Christ, Hobbitmom. I felt as if a burden had been lifted off my shoulders and as if I was filled from my feet to the top of my head at the same time. I've never felt alone since.l

EldarQueen

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 10, 2004 04:32

It was a Hobbit that was chosen to bear the Ring of power and Hobbits played a huge role in the War of the Ring. But in Middle Earth the Hobbits were like "children". They were simple creatures who minded their own buisness. The weren't "counted among the very wise". In the same way Jesus says we are to become like a little child.
Isn't that cool!

I'm going to go back a ways to comment on this. In my devotional Walking With Frodo by Sarah Arthur, she mentions that hobbits have a different resistance to the Ring because they didn't nescessarily want to have much to do with the great deeds of Elves and Men. They were content with their little world, the Shire, and low to the ground (because of their height) which the author says represents their humility. We should be content and be able to resist the temptations of sin because of Christ in us as Christians. We should also take on any task that Jesus (Gandalf) asks us to do.

I love this thread! :love: It's so much fun to talk about this stuff to y'all.

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 10, 2004 06:10

You are so right, EldarQueen, about the Hobbit's. They didn't fill very comfortable around other, except Gandalf, who was taller then them. It was great love :heart: for Sam, Merry and Pippin to go with Frodo. The Shire was a sacred place. Almost like a Paradise for the Hobbits

. It's like the Disciples giving up everything and following Jesus. Wow, I didn't think of it that way untill just now :love:.
Where can I get the devotional "Walking with Frodo"? It sounds very interesting

, EldarQueen.

[Edited on 23/2/2004 by hobbitmom]

EldarQueen

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 10, 2004 06:13

I got the devotional from Barnes & Noble, but it's probably at any Christian bookstore.

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 10, 2004 06:31

Thanks

. Boy, you sure answered my question fast! I have a devotional I do every morning. It's 'TURNING POINT', It's by Dr. David Jeremiah. He's wonderful. Here's the web site;

http://www.turningpointonline.org/

It is very good and It's free to get the "Turning Points" Magazine & Devotional

. All you have to do is write an E-Mail to them

EldarQueen

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 10, 2004 06:38

I've been lurking around CoE most of the night.

That's probably why it was fast.

I'll have to try out that "Turning Points" thing...

Jemima

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 11, 2004 07:29

You can also order Sarah Arthur's book Walking With Frodo from her website - www.saraharthur.com. That's how I got mine and she even signed it.

Could any of you help me out? I'm looking for a place in LOTR that parallels 1 Cor. 1:27-29. " But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things - and the things that are not - to nullify the things that are, so that no one may boast before Him."
I know Gandalf said something like, "the foolish things of this world confound the wise." He was speaking of the Hobbits but I can't find it yet. Maybe someone can help me out and save me some time. Thanks.

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 11, 2004 10:38

Jemima, I think it's in TTT , when Gandalf was talking to Aragorn about the destruction of Saruman, but I'm not sure. I will be working on it today and let you know what I find out

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 13, 2004 03:25

Charis - sounds like you have a cool (and wise) youth leader!

I think it's interesting how Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli didn't recognize Gandalf at first after his return. It reminds me of how the disciples and others didn't recognize Jesus at first after His resurrection. For one thing they didn't expect to see him. He also was different somehow and yet the same. I like in the book how Tolkien said Gandalf appeared to have a light shining out from within him at that point.

I watched the "Two Towers" again. While watching the part where Gandalf appears to Gimli, Aragorn, and Legolas, in Fanorn, I remembered reading this post.
I felt the relieve and hope in their hearts after he came back. The music during this scene, also"lifted me". :heart:

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 16, 2004 09:35

Could any of you help me out? I'm looking for a place in LOTR that parallels 1 Cor. 1:27-29. " But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things - and the things that are not - to nullify the things that are, so that no one may boast before Him."
I know Gandalf said something like, "the foolish things of this world confound the wise." He was speaking of the Hobbits but I can't find it yet. Maybe someone can help me out and save me some time. Thanks.

Jemima, I said I would get back with you on asking for help. I'm so sorry but I couldn't find about what Gandalf said . But I'm not that good in fining things in storys :blush:. I remember reading them but not where I read it . I do remember Gandalf saying, "The foolish things of this world confound the wise." But I don't remember where it is and Gandalf said many wonderful thing in all thr books. I don't know why but TTT still sticks to my mind . Please let me know if you find it yourself or someone finds it for you . I really would like to know. Thanks .

Woodelf 71, you are so right about the music being part with the movie . I always think, What would church be like without the music? It would not bring out your spiritual feelings without singing those wonderful hyms. I really think music is a very important part in live. When I wake up in the morning I have a song in my heart and I'm eather humming, softly singing out loud or in my mind . It's usely a hym to the Lord .

Jemima

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 17, 2004 07:36

Thanks for trying to help Hobbitmom. I'm still looking too. It is an underlying theme of LOTR that the 4 humble Hobbits can make such a huge difference in Middle Earth. They are able to accomplish things that even the greatest like Elrond and Galadriel could not do. And they are able to withstand temptations for power better than Saruman and Denethor. Perhaps their humbleness is what makes them the heroes. They are willing to listen to wisdom from others, accept the fact that they need help, accept correction when they need it, and they are not too proud to do whatever work is asked of them. Through all the amazing hardships, they maintain their loyalty, simplicity (childlike nature), politeness, sense of humor, etc. and win the hearts of many.

Karendil

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 18, 2004 12:03

greetings fellow Christains, I have been meanning to post on this very awesome thread for a long time but things keep getting in the way. mom is trying to get me off the computer so I will have to post again latter.
I have a book to recomend. it's called "Tolkien's Ordinary Virtues / exploring the spiritual themes of The Lord of the Rings" by Mark Eddy Smith. It's an awesome book full of beautiful insights.
It is so cool that you are all here talking about these things.

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 18, 2004 02:33

Welcome, Karendil and God Bless

. Thank you for the info. on this Book, "Tolkien's Ordinary Virtues/exploring the spiritual themes of The Lord Of The Rings". I will check it out. We are looking forword to reading some of your thoughts on how LOTR affect you spiritualy

.

Smile, Jesus Loves you

.

[Edited on 19/2/2004 by hobbitmom]

Wulf_Sternhammer

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 18, 2004 11:47

I have to agree with you Laiquenda, I am also a Pagan/Heathen, and I see many paralells between Tolkiens work and many other mythologies. I have just bought myself a new copy of the Silmarillion, the 1999 reprint and it has a letter at the front of the book from Tolkien to Milton Walderman, long time friend and at the time editor at the publishing house of Collins. In this letter he talks about how many of the themes in his book are common to many mythologies. To quote a Pagan saying, " All gods are one god, and all goddesses are the one goddess." It's good to see someone talking about the coming together of people who have differing ideologies, but still being able to find common ground. Ignoring those differences is not the solution, only in acknowledging accepting each others difference can we resolve the problems of the world. I do believe Tolkien also srongly believed this and it shows in his writings.

Live and love
Wulf.

Karendil

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 20, 2004 07:27

Tolkien must have believed in accepting differences, just look at the Gimli and Legolas. Elves and dwarves have all sorts of things to hold against each other, they have a hard time dealing with differences, (if you have read the Silmarillion you know allot about that) the only thing that really brings them together is their common hate of Sauron and other evils in the world. Gimli and Legolas are certainly no exception to the norm when they start out on the quest but when they learn to understand and accept each other they become the best of friends.
The little hobbit don't think they can make much of a difference do they? every one has a part to play it is clearer to some of them than to others, but each one has, as Sam puts it, "something to do before the end." Like Jemima said, the four little hobbits are humble enough to do what greater people can not, the other character have propose too. Many have several things that seem to happen on accident but become crucial; Boromir is picked to go to Rivendal instead of his brother, (even though it was Faramirs dream that sent him in the first place) though he succumbs to temptation and dies, he dies to save the young hobbits who, inspired by his heroic sacrifices are able to bare the hardships that come. Faramir, who wanted to have Boromirs place in the Fellowship, is able to help Frodo. (Faramir is my hero) Latter, when he would rather be fighting the last battle at his Kings side, he brings healing and hope to Eowyn. I will stop rambling about my favorite character now :blush: . I have been told that God has a plan for me. Maybe if I was told what He wanted me to do I would not think I am capable of it. I may wish I were doing something else that seems, to me, more important. Sometimes I wonder how this will help at all. I cannot see the big picture but God dose and he fits all the pieces together. It's very comforting.

"All you have to do is decide what to do with the time that is given you" ~Gandalf

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 20, 2004 09:37

You are so right Karendil

. The differences of the races in LOTR is, I believe, refers to the differences of the races in our world. Jesus want us to Love :heart: each other no matter what color our skin is or our size. The 4'8" person can be just as helpful as the 6'2"

. God didn't give us a choice on what race we are born in, but he did give us a choice weather to except Him into our hearts. It's also that Sam, Merry and Pippin had a choice weather to go with Frodo or not. And even though Frodo was the one selected to destroy the Ring, he still was given the choice to choose that grate task.
Friendships are wonderful. My Sig, "To have a friend is to be a friend", means a lot to me

. Sometimes a good friendship runs on shaky grown before it blossoms. Just as it was for Legolas and Gimli. As time went by they became very good friends

.
I also believe that each and everyone of us has something to do before the end.

AlatarielofRivendell

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 21, 2004 04:47

I think its cool how the fellowship is made up of all the different races of ME. If we look at the bible, God uses so many different types of people. He uses kings and servents, fisher-men and tax-collecters. And no matter how small or insignificant we may think ourselves, God can still use us, just like the hobbits accomplished great htings, despite their simplicity. And I think we all have a purpose here, which is definatly a theme in LOTR, that there is a bigger plan. We all have a part to play in this tale.

I saw ROTK again yesterday and at the end Frodo says, "Bilbo told me once his part in this tale would end." And so must all of our parts end. But we must remember that we DO have a part to play, a role in the tale. And we don't always know how important our role may be. Frodo had no idea just how important his role would be when he set out. And we may not know the significance of our part in the story. As Gandalf says, "all we can do is decide what to do with time given you."

I encorage you all to do something with your part of the tale, to decide what you will do with the time given you.

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 21, 2004 06:25

I love this thread. "The Lord of the Rings" has been such a great inspiration for me. I would like to share something that I found on Intimacy.

"The transformation that is reshaping the human experience is introducing millions of individuals to the possibility of intimacy and providing glimpses of a way of being that makes all others unsatisfactory. It is the intuition that a difficult situation has meaning for you. It is the sudden moment of empathy with someone who previously seemed repugnant. It is the insight into the fears, struggles, and joys of another. It is melting into your own humanity." :heart:

The Heart of the Soul by: Gary Zukav and Linda Francis

Jemima

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 21, 2004 10:18

Karendil, my favorite hero is Faramir, too - especially in the book. He just does and says such awesome things. I read that Tolkien considered himself to be most like Faramir although he also thought of himself as a Hobbit.
The above discussions remind me that Sauron's two main weapons seemed to be fear and spreading mistrust between the races of Middle Earth with his deceptions and rumors and gossip. Much of this was made more clear in The Silmarillion, but is is also talked about in LOTR. It wasn't until the different races learned to put aside their past grudges, forgive each other, and learn to work together and love each other that they became effective in standing up against their enemy. This all reminds me so much of the Christian church and, in fact, in one of his letters, Tolkien compares the Fellowship to the Christian Church.
I think Satan seeks to destroy the church often through gossip, grudges, and unforgiving hearts. He wants to divide and conquer. When we can learn to work together in love and Fellowship, we can storm the gates of Mordor.
Frodo reminds me a lot of David in the Bible. He was the least likely to be chosen amongst all the great leaders at the Council of Elrond. But they were all distracted by the seemingly invincible "giant" Sauron and his armies. It took the least of them (Frodo) to say, "I'll take the ring."

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 23, 2004 08:38

Hi all

! I kind of faded away from here for awhile. I just wanted to let you all post things in without me being between each post

. First I want to welcome any newcomers

. And to my oldies but goodies

, I would like to see more posting :love:. There's a lot of story in the Books and movies to give some really good stories on affecting you spiritualy

. Every time I watch the movies or read bits and pieces of the books I think of something

.
In ROTK when the armys were at the Black Gate and the evil army, of Sauron, came pouring out of the Gate. After the great evil army circled the small good army and they both stared at each other for some time. Aragorn finally turned and said, "For Frodo", and they attacked. They knew they would probably die, but a wonderful thing happened, Frodo destroyed the Ring and the evil army ran away because they lost their leader. This reminds me when Jesus meet the man that was possessed with many demons. They were making him hurt himself and cry out. Jesus told them to leave and without the power of the man they were helpless. I know with the power of Jesus in me, there is no room for demins

Jemima

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 24, 2004 09:55

I just saw the movie again this weekend and Hobbitmom's last post just reminded me of one of my favorite scenes. It is just after the ring is destroyed and Barad Dur is destroyed and suddenly a huge crack opens up in the earth and splits from the destroyed tower out and through the gates. The crack continues on until it reaches the armies of Rohan and Gondor. They stand within a circle protected (by the hand of God perhaps.) The evil armies are swallowed up. The faithful remnant is saved. They are not saved by their own power, but by their decision to remain faithful.
It reminds me of what happens to the unfaithful in the book of Numbers Chapter 16 when the earth swallows up the people who are rebellious against God.
I remember reading an interview with PJ before ROTK came out and he called ROTK "Biblical". I think this scene is part of what he was talking about.

rohanmaiden

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 25, 2004 12:06

Wow! This is cool!

I'm Catholic (same as Tolkien

) and this is one of the neatest threads I've seen here! Probably my very, very, favorite reference I've noticed is the lembas bread and Holy Communion. In ROTK, it says that the lembas bread strengthened the will and gave Frodo and Sam perseverence to go on; without these qualities of the lemabs bread, they could not have done the mission. The Eucharist does the same thing for all who partake. I'm a living example. Without mass and communion, I'd probably be going crazy, lol. The Paths of the Dead reminds me of purgatory because the Dead had failed in life, but in death they redeemed themselves. The Silmarillion also has quite a few referenes. The Valar are like the Trinity in that there are many, but they rule in harmony as One. Melkor is like satan, destroying what is good and leading people astray. I'll write more when I think of some.

This is a really interesting thread! I really like reading what you all write.

God bless!

AlatarielofRivendell

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 25, 2004 02:14

I watched Fellowship again a couple days ago. While we were watching th council of Elrond scene, a thought struck me. Boromir asks, "what does a ranger from the north know?" and Legolas answers, "This is no mere ranger. This is Aragorn, Son of Arathorn, you owe him your allegience." Anyway, I was just thinking that was what it was like when Jesus came into the world-many people didn't recognize him. But what gets me most is what Boromir says a couple lines later. "Gondor has no king, Gondor needs no king." So often this is our response to Jesus. We think that we don't need him, we want to do it our own way. We don't want to "bow to this ranger from the north," as Denethor says. But Jesus is the King and deserves that place in our life.

Jemima

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 26, 2004 09:00

Rohanmaiden's post reminded me about something that struck me about Lembas bread. The more the person eating it depended on it instead of on any other food, the more virtue it had for the eater. It's like the more we depend on God and his daily bread, and the less we depend on the world for our sustenance, the more virtue we receive.
And AlatarielofRivendell reminded me aof a great quote from ROTK. After Denethor says he "will not bow to this ranger from the North," Gandalf says, "Authority is not given to you to deny the Return of the King." It just reminds me of the sovereignty of Jesus Christ and how no one can ultimately deny his power or his authority.

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 26, 2004 09:01

Welcome to our little group, rohanmaiden

. I am so looking forword to read more of your thoughts

. I truly enjoyed reading what you wrote :love:.

rohanmaiden

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 28, 2004 10:28

After Denethor says he "will not bow to this ranger from the North," Gandalf says, "Authority is not given to you to deny the Return of the King." It just reminds me of the sovereignty of Jesus Christ and how no one can ultimately deny his power or his authority.

Oh yes! How interesting! Your post also reminded me of in the movie The Passion (I saw it Thursday-sooooo good!!!) Pontius Pilate asks Jesus what he should do and says he has power over Christ's death, Christ says "You have no power over me except what is given you from Above." Jemima's post reminded me of that.

Also in The Passion...St. Peter and Judas reminded me of Boromir and Denethor. St. Peter denied Christ but then he repented and went on to lead the Church. Judas betrayed Christ and killed himself in despair.

Thanks Hobbitmom!!

You make me feel so welcome.:love: This is an awesome thread.:love:

God bless

Nauma

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 28, 2004 05:14

Seeing The Passion put me in a contemplative mood, and the fact that the actor who plays Christ looks like Aragorn to me just helped reinforce a LotR reflection...

Aragorn is king by birthright, but he does not use his position. He "made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant" (Phil. 2:7). He was willing to give his life to save the hobbits, and to do that he rode up to the very gates of the Enemy's territory. And after it all, he takes up his rightful place as King and Lord. Don't know about you, but I can't wait for the real coronation; it's going to be even better than the movie!

hobbitmom

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 28, 2004 07:39

Welcome, Nauma, to our group

. Thank you for your thoughts about "The Passion". I haven't seen it yeat but have heard wonderful things about it

. I hope you write more of your thoughts. I enjoyed what you wrote very much

.

God bless you, rohanmaiden, for your thoughts about the thread. I hope it helps everyone to strengthen their Faith with Christ. Boy, I know it has me

. I enjoy to read everything all of you have wrote. Just yesterday I read everything over again. It's like watching a movie or reading a book over again, I had more of those worm fuzzy fillings again :love:. I love it. God Bless you all :heart:.

narsiljm

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 29, 2004 02:25

When I was reading LOTR for the first time (that's already a few years ago), I didn't realize it, but those books have affected me in a lot of ways. The way I think, the way I feel, are both affected by Tolkien's books.

AlatarielofRivendell

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 29, 2004 05:56

Aragorn is king by birthright, but he does not use his position. He "made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant" (Phil. 2:7). He was willing to give his life to save the hobbits, and to do that he rode up to the very gates of the Enemy's territory. And after it all, he takes up his rightful place as King and Lord. Don't know about you, but I can't wait for the real coronation; it's going to be even better than the movie!

That's really cool! I can't wait to see the Passion. I've heard it is very powerful.

rohanmaiden

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 29, 2004 10:23

That's really cool! I can't wait to see the Passion. I've heard it is very powerful.

Aye, indeed it is!

A thought that came to me at mass today: the way that Aragorn was a (or believed to be) just a simple ranger who was in fact this great kind descended from noble birth is like how Christ was a simple carpenter who was really the Son of the Most High. Both were despised and/or feared by some. In The Passion, Jim Caviezal does look like Aragorn. I didn't really think of that before for some reason, but you're right Nauma! Though I think Jim Caveizal is even more beautiful. Probably because of his role.

EldarQueen

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: February 29, 2004 01:45

Aragorn is king by birthright, but he does not use his position. He "made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant" (Phil. 2:7). He was willing to give his life to save the hobbits, and to do that he rode up to the very gates of the Enemy's territory. And after it all, he takes up his rightful place as King and Lord.

Wow, I just realized that when you said that, Nauma! It makes me think of all the joy that happened after the coronation. I can't wait!

And after that, when the hobbits return to the Shire, they identify themselves as "messengers of the King." Saruman's men noticed that there was something different about the hobbits, aside from the way they were dressed, etc., and that they acted with confidence. We can act with confidence because we know God is always with us. And that is an encouraging thought.

Nauma

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RE: How did LotR affect you spiritually?
on: March 01, 2004 03:03

Well, it's not LotR, but this phrase from the Silmarillion struck me as I was reading it. The scene is Ilúvatar questioning Aulë about the Dwarves, whom Aulë has made in secret. Aulë recognizes that the Dwarves are imperfect, but he says, "As a child to his father, I offer to thee these things, the work of the hands which thou hast made. Do with them what thou wilt." And then Ilúvatar remakes the Dwarves and gives them a place in his plan for Middle-earth.

Doesn't this sound like us? We give God our flawed lives, our meager talents, realizing how imperfect they are, but offering them anyway. And he takes them and heals them, and then he uses them in his kingdom plans. Isn't it wonderful that God can use even us, his very flawed servants, to do his work?

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